28 Comments:
Not one week ago, I saw Peter Bell telling Almanac that buses were still on the table, and that costs had to come way the heck down before they could execute the plan. St. Paul wants a project that will probably top $1 billion by the end, and if they're counting on that money to fix University, they're too late. Just yesterday, I biked down that road, and saw a pothole that could quite literally swallow a kitten or small puppy. The sidewalks near the Amtrak depot are crumbling. The list goes on. Whatever they build for the central corridor, I hope that the Met Council won't let the city/county maintain that infrastructure.
»» Submitted by »»» champs at 9:19 AM on June 29
It's about time. Now we have up to ten years of hand-wringing and eventually construction to look forward to before we can ride it. Maybe 15, actually.
»» Submitted by »»» tmayhem at 10:25 AM on June 29
I still don't understand why anyone would want a rail line between downtowns -- where there is good bus service at all hours -- rather than running a line out to the SW transit terminal in Eden Prairie. Get the damned commuters and their Humscalades off of 169, 94, and 62. That would do much more for congestion than shuttling people between downtowns.
It will be interesting to see how they bring the costs under control. I hope they shift a lot of costs to the city and county.
»» Submitted by »»» kwatt at 10:38 AM on June 29
There is always a ton of congestion between the cities... but I too think it would make more sense to go down to Eden Prairie or Burnsville down 35W or Maple Grove (I'm selfish) or Plymouth out 394. Those are more complex, even more expensive LRT lines, though.
Soon I'll be able to get sauced up downtown and take the rail to the Rollergirl bouts. The bus makes my brat and beer want to come up.
»» Submitted by Foster at 11:02 AM on June 29
After reading Foster, The Rat rejoices at his ability to work at home.
»» Submitted by The Rat at 11:16 AM on June 29
What? I don't drink and drive. Never said I did.
You're not drinking while working at home, are you?
»» Submitted by Foster at 11:21 AM on June 29
No. And I'm not riding the bus with some guy hoping to hold down his most recent meal, either. Love public transit, but that, I choose to avoid.
If there's one. there are more.
»» Submitted by The Rat at 12:09 PM on June 29
Bah. I bet you don't ride the rides at the state fair either. Live a little.
»» Submitted by Foster at 12:25 PM on June 29
I've seen arguments among guys smelling like the aftershave they drank, had one bus I was on shot at by a kid who looked about 13, and been propositioned by gays on this city's fine public transportation system
How much more I have to experience before I can say I've lived a little?
»» Submitted by The Rat at 12:30 PM on June 29
One late afternoon about 10 years ago, I was returning from a boring temp job on the bus and listened to some guy boasting that he could be in New York or San Diego tomorrow.
"I'm going to a whorehouse for two weeks," he announced.
When the driver told him to sit down and shut up he said, "just get me to Lake Street."
Evidently, he decided to Explore Minnesota instead.
»» Submitted by The Rat at 12:41 PM on June 29
Anyone who says the bus lines between the downtowns is fine has either:
-never ridden the 16
-never had to go to midway or anywhere BETWEEN the downtowns
-just hates poor people
Also, the last thing we need is suburban LRT. If you want trains in the burbs, lobby for some commuter rail like the northstar to your hood. Suburbs both cannot adequately support and do not deserve regular rapid transit, or else they wouldn't be suburbs. You need higher density than suburbs are built at to justify anything more than commuter rail.
That said, I'd love to see a good commuter rail network around the cities too.
Keep in mind that one of the major arguments made for rail is that rail is more about development than it's about transportation. Add some new/better bus routes and everything stays the same, put in a new LRT and hey, it's showtime!
I grew up riding the 21A and the 16. Gives me shivers just thinking about it.
»» Submitted by Saloth Sar at 3:11 PM on June 29
the best thing about riding the #16 is that no matter which Downtown you start in, there always seems to be some Nut already riding it who looks as if they want to rip your heart out of your chest...
well, maybe that's the worst thing.
»» Submitted by »»» cjl at 3:21 PM on June 29
Keep in mind that one of the major arguments made for rail is that rail is more about development than it's about transportation. Add some new/better bus routes and everything stays the same, put in a new LRT and hey, it's showtime!
Which is why I think cities and counties should be on the hook for more of the costs. But anyway...
I've said many times I'm a daily rider between the downtowns and I have to say I rarely ride the 16 but when I have it hasn't been the nightmare some say. It's not the 463 from Burnsville, but it ain't the 5 either. Plus, the 50 and the 94 are full of freaks, too. Anyone ever rid the 53? What's that like?
»» Submitted by »»» kwatt at 3:31 PM on June 29
The 16 has the 50 and the 94.
The 21 (finally) has the 53.
It's not like transit users have a lack of options.
»» Submitted by champs|mobile at 3:33 PM on June 29
Actually they DO lack options, because those are all buses. Ka-ching!
Also, mention of the five reminds me how asinine it is that they seem to never even have considered turning part or all of the 5 into LRT. Now there's a line that could really benefit, but no one wants to spend any more money on the mostly poor people who ride it. Even though I'm glad about the central corridor going forward, the one lady who voted against and said that it was another middle-class entitlement (strib article I think?) has a point. Less of a point than if she were talking about hiawatha, but still a point.
To all the people who want LRT to Edina I say "amen", but I think they did this one first because of political reasons...all the rail development so fare (Hiawatha and Northstar) has been west metro. If they did *another* line in the west metro, it'd basically be a big "F U" to St. Paul and the east metro.
I expect the next line will be the southwest Downtown/Eden Prairie route.
»» Submitted by Luke at 4:27 PM on June 29
As someone living in downtown St. Paul I'd really love to see a really fast LRT to Minneapolis. I'm talking no stops, just vroom, 10 minutes and you're there. I take the 94 now, but it still takes too long and doesn't run often enough during non rush hours. Plus, I have to walk six blocks to get to the stop. The Hiawatha is fine, but man is that thing slow. They (whoever "they" might be), should really investigate doing a "local" and an "express". Don't know if anyone has done that with LRT, but it's pretty common with the big trains, you just need passing track.
I also want the express train to Chicago. Super fast, twice a day.
Now make it so.
»» Submitted by Saloth Sar at 5:13 PM on June 29
Yay LRT! I just hope I'm patient enough to stick around here to see it...and good idea on the express train to Chicago. That'd be super sweet.
»» Submitted by »»» martaru at 5:43 PM on June 29
Minneapolis to Madison, Milwaukee, Chicago in 5 hours. Make it so!
»» Submitted by Luke at 6:08 PM on June 29
Er, "Edina" -> "Eden Prairie" in my comment above.
»» Submitted by Luke at 6:11 PM on June 29
I think the new line is a great idea. If you've ever ridden on the 16 or 50 during rush hour during the school year, there are many times you can't even get on it in the campus area because it is packed to the brim. And who knows, maybe this could liven up the St. Paul night life when people can more easily get there. I've gone to plenty of cool places in downtown St. Paul, but there aren't enough people around to make it a crazy good time.
And if you want cheap and relatively fast (for a bus) trip to Chicago, look at MEGABUS! http://megabus.com/us/. They claim you can get a one-way ticket for $1 and I've seen some prices in the $10 range. And it doesn't stop along the way.
»» Submitted by Emily M. at 8:34 PM on June 29
LRT along route 5 would be worthless. It won't take drivers off the highways and transit users along that route have already shown a willingness to ride the bus.
»» Submitted by »»» kwatt at 10:50 PM on June 29
Incidentally, is any of this CCLRT development the sort of "development" St. Paul gave to the Rondo neighborhood when it came time to choose a route for I-94?
»» Submitted by »»» champs at 11:12 PM on June 29
That's it, champs. Someone at the Met Council heard that University Avenue was paved with "blacktop" and decided that it should be dug up, ASAP.
Have you noticed that the sleepers (i.e., railroad ties) for the Hiawatha LRT are all white? It's because the MN government hates the Black people, and will stop at nothing to spite them at every turn.
»» Submitted by mike s at 12:53 AM on June 29
Incidentally, is any of this CCLRT development the sort of "development" St. Paul gave to the Rondo neighborhood when it came time to choose a route for I-94?
No. That was a 300-foot swath, this will be more like 30.
»» Submitted by Buckwheat at 8:29 AM on June 30
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