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MNSpeak: Talk
A dose of Bachmann
"We're losing our country," [Bachmann] said. "People are not assimilating themselves to America. They're not speaking English, and you must speak it if you want to succeed here in this country." ...
"And the argument that fences don't work doesn't hold water. Look at Israel and Palestine Fences work..."
Reader Comments
lol!
Reagan: "Mr. Gorbachov tear down this wall"
she should listen to her republican hero.
I always wonder if people like her would be okay with illegal immigration if the immigrants learned to speak English first.
Can we really expect better from someone whose personal crusade includes an investigation of whether CFLs really save that much energy? I can't even accuse her of being in corporate pockets since no corporation is stupid enough to back that brand of lunacy.
She may have had a semi-valid argument until she threw in the Israel tidbit. It's really sad that she's the voice of that particular district. People like that make Minnesotans (to outsiders) look like a bunch of mouth-breathing creationists.
Patty Wetterling. Yeah, that's the ticket.
Someone's stuck in '06. We're not comparing Bachmann to Wetterling. We're comparing Bachmann to people whose ignorance is baffling.
We need to figure out how to get hardworking people into this country legally and then close the boarder. The best and cheapest way is to mine the boarder.
The boarder? You mean, the guy who lives in my spare room?
I've noticed an interesting anomoly of late. folks who are in favor of human rights abuses can't spell. discuss.
If you want to he may not like it.
U-oh. Grote just fell prey to the essential irony of the Internet. Whenever somebody comments to make fun of someone's spelling or grammer, they will commit a spelling or grammer error.
Anomaly.
As demonstrated by my own misspelling of grammar.
Max, we're coming over later to help you mine your boarder.
I'll show you how to do it:
The borarder! He's mine!
Land mines? Seriously?
Aside from the absurd notion of using land mines on U.S. soil, or anywhere for that matter, something tells that would only result in Minutemen blowing themselves up.
That doggone boarder is mine.
dezelske FTW
I can't understand the way you think, Ang,
Saying that the boarder is yours.
The boarder is mine, Ang.
The doggone boarder is mine.
doh. Clearly, I'm no CJ.
Max cites Skitt's Law. Since somebody invaribly will also complain about the Speling Nazi's [sic], there is a high concurrence of Skitt's Law and Godwin's Law.
And I agree with Bachmann. The wall around Palestine is doing great job at keeping out the Mexicans.
msparber, we're not going to fight about this, okay
JACC, I think I told you, I'm a lover not a fighter.
This thread just became 4 more shades of cool.
I've heard it all before, msparber, boarder told me that I'm her forever miner,
You know, don't you remember?
But we both cannot have him
So it's one or the other
And one day you'll discover
That he's my boarder forever and ever
Don't build your hopes to be let down
'Cause I really feel it's time
I know he'll tell you I'm the one for him
'Cause he said I blow his mind
this boarder you speak of, is he handy with the steel?
Does he "earn his keep"
Is that what he said?
Yes, he said it, you keep dreaming.
I would put land mines in my basement, but Amber would be perturbed.
People are so r-tarded. I'm sorry, first generation immigrants don't need to speak perfect English. Their kids always will, got that fräulein Bachman?
It's like we've got some sort of national passive aggression thing going on with languages. Kind of a "well, I only speak English so everyone else should to". She should take look at someplace like Switzerland or South Africa where kids learn three or four languages in school.
Yeah. I suppose it's more logical, easier and cheaper to print all of our government documents, signs, drivers license exams, etc., in 62 different languages than to simply expect people coming here to speak English. I suppose that's why you're smart enough to work for the government and I'm not.
Yeah. I suppose it's more logical, easier and cheaper to print all of our government documents, signs, drivers license exams, etc., in 62 different languages than to simply expect people coming here to speak English.
False dillema. And a total flight of fantasy. I have yet to see a stop sign printed in 62 languages.
I have yet to see a stop sign printed in 62 languages.
Last week I saw a stop sign that was about waist level high.
I named it the "cock blocker".
Since the drivers exams are printed in multiple languages, it makes sense to print signs in multiple langauges, since we don't know if people can read them anymore.
Hey, I can drive legally in France, doesn't mean any of the signs were in English...
I took a divers license exam last year. Not printed in multiple languages.
Maybe that's why you failed.
Oooh, burn.
Wait. I passed.
Actually, I'm not a huge proponent of translating everything into other languages, I'm just against people being told they have to speak English or else. I've moved to a couple countries without speaking the language. I managed to deal with the bureaucracies just fine and eventually learned the language, dit is niet te zwaar, klopt?
Plus -- signs don't need to be printed in multiple languages. Most signs have a distinct shape and color (intentionally) and the vast majority don't need to be read to be understood. Except for maybe the "Slow Children at Play" signs, and really -- there are too many kids wandering around out there anyway.
The point is, you're not doing any of these immigrants any favors by making it easier for them to function without speaking english. If you want them to survive in this society without limiting their employment options to fast food or roofing, they need to learn english asap. Sending any other message or delaying the inevitable is hurting them, even as you may feel better about your "tolerance."
Oh, I know. When someone is filling out the tax form, it is such a disservice to give them a Spanish language version. They should have to work through it with a Spanish-English dictionary. Because everywhere else, people speak Spanish all the time, and all the street signs are in Spanish, and every person who works at every store in America is bilingual, so there is no need to speak Spanish when you go shopping. So if it weren't for enforced bilingualism at the tax office, or, say, at the emergency room, which would be another great place for people to whip out their English-Hmoob dictionary, they would never get an opportunity to learn English at all.
I'm not sure I buy the argument, Maz. There are any number of countries around the world that get by with a lingual stew. Not to mention how many cities right here in the U.S. have huge populations of folks with limited grasp of English who do just fine.
Arbitrarily declaring English to be the answer to all our problems seems simplistic. Sure, it helps, but we haven't required English for the last 200 years. Seems odd to be advocating for it now.
Ik ook, Saloth Sar!
1. It's not like we're going to turn into Quebec just because documents are available in a multitude of languages. Good grief, what a horrible horrible place.
2. Bachmann is the embodiment of a "fucktard".
richg nails it. It seems that a few afraid of change or fearful of *gasp* having to learn something new are those whose feathers are ruffled. There has to be a compromise and bilingualism to a certain extent isn't exactly bad. Travel some and soon you'll recognize that there are plenty of places where you'll hear more than one language.
I tend to agree with the need for a single recognized language, but I think all of you have it completely wrong.
IIRC, weren't the English the original (and only real) opressors of Our Great Nation? Well, they were. And, as such, I propose that we create a whole new language and call it Murrican. Why should we show favor to the English? Fuck 'em.
Well, maz, you have the asswipe Rep. Drazkowski in your corner:
Statistics like this have driven me to introduce a bill this session that will make English Minnesotas official language. Part of the reason is formal, the other part is practical, as it would require anyone taking a drivers license test to receive the exam in English and complete it without the use of an interpreter.
To me, the bill is common sense; if you cant read the road signs, then how are you expected to be an effective driver? Its just further incentive to learn English and become better acclimated to life in Minnesota.
Meanwhile, county courts across the state are left to deal with rising interpreter costs. And, at least in Winona County, these escalating costs are going to put some people out of work.
Tell that witch to get off our a$$es, due.
Bachmann looks like a he/she to me me.
I bet she's dangling some lose coins under those manties of hers.
"Except for maybe the "Slow Children at Play" signs, "
I hate those signs. So there's some slow children playing... slow children like to play, too. There's no reason to put up a sign making fun of them.
That puzzles me. Street signs are not especially complicated thing. Just because you can't translate Bertrand Russell doesn't mean you're going to be confused at to what Baker Street is. Is there an epidemic of immigrants with poor English skills getting caught in cul-de-sacs?
I have noticed some immigrant drivers are especially bad. Which makes them slightly worse than your average Minnesota driver.
lol grote! r own lnguage? rotfl! prolly not going 2 hpn! 2 hard 4 ppl 2 lrn! OMG!
Maybe I should kick people off MnSpeak who don't speak leet.
South Africa has nine official languages! Makes for wicked hip hop.
Maz, I'm surprised you want this mandated. Why not let the market decide?
l33t haxxors pwn u bachmann!
richg nails it. It seems that a few afraid of change or fearful of *gasp* having to learn something new are those whose feathers are ruffled. There has to be a compromise and bilingualism to a certain extent isn't exactly bad. Travel some and soon you'll recognize that there are plenty of places where you'll hear more than one language
In the private sector that is fine, speak what you want. When the tax payer has to foot the bill, to print and teach people English that is not OK. Why should Americans pay for it. You can speak and be as multicultural as you want to be as long as taxpayers do not have to pay for it. How about this, you pay for the translation of all of the documents to to translated into what ever language you feel appropriate.
People who don't speak English also pay taxes, Swandog. just imagine that their taxes are paying the tiny printing fee you speak of, and your taxes are paying for war, or whatever good use you think taxes can be put to.
To follow up on max's points, when you start talking about things like emergency services, or access to the courts, you run up against the ideas of equality before the law, and due process that are written into the Constitution. Those are pretty hard to provide for under maz's and swandog's proposals.
I'm less worried about printing signs in other languages for people that can read than I am about people who are citizens of the US and can't read.
And I refuse to acknowledge Michelle Bachman's existence. It's impossible that a majority of any group of people could have voted someone so hateful, ignorant and crazy into office.
And what happened to concepts of personal liberty, Maz? You can't stand the idea that someone might mandate clear air in a bar, but you feel like the state should force someone to speak a language that is foreign to them? A language that is not the official, legal language of the United States, by the way, but just one favored by the majority.
Come to think of it, wasn't Bachmann trying to pass a bill preserving our right to choose light bulbs? But she can't stand that someone might choose to speak their onw language?
I guess freedom of choice is reserved for people who grew up speaking English, however poorly.
give maz a moment. his free-market liberty filter is re-booting.
So that's why I hear whirring and smell smoke.
Why should Americans pay for it.
Americans should pay for it because not all Americans speak English.
give maz a moment. his free-market liberty filter is re-booting.
This is usually when he disappears from the conversation altogether or comes back with something particularly trolly or outlandish. I wait eagerly...
So if we make English Minnesota's official language, I'd like to see all of our native casino's switch to their native language. All the signage, all communications etc. Let's see how quickly our gambling-addicted friends pick up Objibwe (that's Anishinabe to you, bub).
People who don't speak English also pay taxes, Swandog. just imagine that their taxes are paying the tiny printing fee you speak of, and your taxes are paying for war, or whatever good use you think taxes can be put to.
The cost of services that are needed to interpret, translate and print the documents are not even close to being paid for by someone in a low paying job. (I am assuming that most people that do not speak the language are rarely ceo's). The marginal taxes that they do pay are dwarfed by the services needed. They do not pay for it.
To follow up on max's points, when you start talking about things like emergency services, or access to the courts, you run up against the ideas of equality before the law, and due process that are written into the Constitution. Those are pretty hard to provide for under maz's and swandog's proposals.
I would agree with you that when it comes to the courts and only in limited circumstances, you do need to have translators available. The need for constitutional fairness necessitates an interpreter.
And what happened to concepts of personal liberty, Maz? You can't stand the idea that someone might mandate clear air in a bar, but you feel like the state should force someone to speak a language that is foreign to them? A language that is not the official, legal language of the United States, by the way, but just one favored by the majority.
They can speak whatever language they want, but others do not have the responsibility to pay for it. By choosing not to learn the language that is a choice. If you do not understand what the majority of the population is saying to bad so sad. They can buy an interpreter that is a choice.
So that's why I hear whirring and smell smoke.
nope. that's your vaporizer.
speaking of which, this seems like as good a place as any to ask if anyone going to see Man Man @ the Varsity next Friday?
you know you guys, I see this both ways. When I have been to Mexico, I speak Spanish. I don't always do very well, but I have always understood that 'they appreciate it' if you attempt to learn and speak their native language.
Why is it such a bad thing to expect/help immigrants in this country to help learn our native language? And don't give me the 'it's not the official language' schpiel, it may as well be. It's how business is run in the US.
You all jumped on Maz, ridiculing him, and his point is actually a pretty good one. Maz's point was not inflammatory, not derogatory, and he actually made a bit of sense, in that the only way that the majority of immigrants are going to reach beyond minimum wage thankless jobs is if they learn to speak the language of the country they live in.
We need to HELP, not force, immigrants to learn English, otherwise they will always be a secluded class, instead of harnessing the American dream and becoming greedy capitalists like the rest of us.
I'm sure if you asked, the majority of immigrants would like to learn how to speak English, they just don't know where to begin.
The cost of services that are needed to interpret, translate and print the documents are not even close to being paid for by someone in a low paying job.
Links please. Or am I correct in assuming you have no idea how much it costs, and that you have no idea how much, collectively, the people who use these service pay in taxes?
You all jumped on Maz, ridiculing him, and his point is actually a pretty good one. Maz's point was not inflammatory, not derogatory, and he actually made a bit of sense, in that the only way that the majority of immigrants are going to reach beyond minimum wage thankless jobs is if they learn to speak the language of the country they live in.
That was not his point. It was the excuse for his point. His point was that government documents should not be printed in languages other than English, because somehow that keeps people from learning English, which is ridiculous.
When I have been to Mexico, I speak Spanish.
I speak Spanglish, which I happen to think is pretty much the perfect language.
They can speak whatever language they want, but others do not have the responsibility to pay for it.
Why should they pay for your English documents? English is, I remind you, not the official language of the United States.
It takes ten years of immersion in a new language to become fully fluent. How are people going to get to ESL classes if they can't get a bus schedule in a language they understand? What if they get sick while they're still learning?
Oh, and my Scandihoovian ancestors didn't learn English until the second generation, AND the gub-ment gave them free land. These problems aren't new. They're just decidedly brown-er these days, which upsets folks more.
We need to HELP, not force, immigrants to learn English, otherwise they will always be a secluded class, instead of harnessing the American dream
Exactly Michelle Bachmann's point. silly liberals.
Which point? The one about the fence?
When I was in Mexico, everyone spoke english...but I was in Cancun.
All you need to know how to speak in Mexico is the Lambada, the dance that speaks the forbidden language of love.
Please tell me a Lambada Fad Dance is in the works.
Oh yes.
AYE DE MI
That went from hot to gross in record time, Alie.
I would agree with you that when it comes to the courts and only in limited circumstances, you do need to have translators available. The need for constitutional fairness necessitates an interpreter.
I would argue that Constitutional fairness necessitates them for ANY governmental function. It's a pretty hollow equality before the law otherwise.
pinche idiotas.
Sparber, i don't buy that point anymore. It's like two middle aged peeps, sharing the mortgage, sharing bank accounts and car payments, without the offcial marriage certificate. It doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things that it's not offcial.
Grote, counter that point with something substantial--you know it is at least partially true.
I just knew that the smartest of you people would eventually come to the correct conclusion without a single additional keystroke from moi. Dang these long meetings.
All I am sayin g, is that the immigrant class will continue being disparate from the rest of society, unless we help them assimilate to some degree, especially in the communication realm. Trust me, it is a lot easier to get around in Mexico if you can communicate. Many Mexicans don't speak English, and they expect you to speak Spanish in many parts. And Aliecat, Cancun is like a tropical Billy's on Grand. It doesn't count.
Sparber, i don't buy that point anymore. It's like two middle aged peeps, sharing the mortgage, sharing bank accounts and car payments, without the offcial marriage certificate. It doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things that it's not offcial.
Sure it does. Or talk to a lesbian couple of 20 years, one in a coma, the other denied access to their significant other because the family won't allow it, and the court doesn't recognize the couple as married.
Sometimes, the letter of the law makes an enormous difference.
And Aliecat, Cancun is like a tropical Billy's on Grand. It doesn't count.
Dude, I know...
I just knew that the smartest of you people would eventually come to the correct conclusion without a single additional keystroke from moi.
What, that you're skilled in double talk and a borderline hypocrite? Guess I'm a genious then.
Don't tell me you didn't fantasize about Betty White, Max.
I thought Blanche was the one that put out.
@baker...are you referring to this point:
We need to HELP, not force, immigrants to learn English, otherwise they will always be a secluded class, instead of harnessing the American dream
if so, I agree with it 100%. What I was getting at is that it's not Bachmann's motivation for suggesting the legislation. Not when she's playing on the xenophobic leanings of her constituents with statements like, "We're losing our country,".
yeah grote, i figured. just couldn't really get what you were trying to say. and of course this is not bachmann's motivation, she is a horrible person, who could care less what hapens to immigrants.
Sometimes, the letter of the law makes an enormous difference.
Sometimes, yes. But not in this case. What other language would they print materials in if not English? It matters not that the offcial language is not English, when over 80% of our countrymen speak it.
Singapore is one country where multi-lingualism is taken seriously. Because of political and religious sensitivities, government forms and many signs are printed in four languages: English, Mandarin, Bahasa Malay and Tamil. Students are required to learn a second language, beginning at the 3rd primary level, and the 2nd language can't be one spoken at home. (Some households can speak both Mandarin and English, so a student would have to choose between Malay or Tamil to fulfill the language requirement.)
No one bitches about it there; it's just a matter of having the language tools needed to conduct business on an international level, and everyone understands the importance of that when you're from a country that has absolutely no natural resources. (Even water is imported into Singapore from Malaysia and Indonesia.)
The arrogance of some Americans saddens me. Not only do we expect everyone else around the world to speak our language, even if we're visiting or doing business someplace 10,000 miles from the US, some of us can't assimilate enough into a local, overseas environment -- however temporary it might be -- to forego our need for McDonalds.
Being told we're loud and brash (which some of us are overseas but not nearly so much as the Australians) isn't nearly the problem that being culturally and linguistically ignorant are in a world that is becoming increasingly multi-lingual.
I really did not know that this many states had 'English only' Legislation.
And when the petro ero replaces the petro dollar, and the euro or yuan replaces the dollar as the preferred reserve currency, how tolerant are foreign business partners going to be of American businessmen that can't conduct business in anything other than English?
I really did not know that this many states had 'English only' Legislation.
I can't imagine how effective those laws are. Does anyone really think that services in California, Florida and Illinois are REALLY only offered in English?
Nonsense. This is most culturally tolerant nation on earth. Go to any other continent and demand that all their official documents be printed in your obscure language and see how far it gets you. You can't even move to canada unless you jump through a mile of hoops and promise your first born. Here, people get free health care and free education and no one expects any different. People risk their lives to come here and for good reason. But they will only succees if they can function within this society ... which means speaking the dominant language.
I never advocated that people be forced to do anything. I only said that not encouraging their learning english is not helping them.
Betty had bigger hooters, though...
(God, why do I know this?)
Does that matter if you can't play with them?
yeah, I'm sure they aren't very effective...
interesting that they are on the books even.
Nonsense. This is most culturally tolerant nation on earth. Go to any other continent and demand that all their official documents be printed in your obscure language and see how far it gets you.
And yet that's exactly what you've been arguing for in this thread. So, if providing adequate documents in a variety of languages is tolerance, what is it you are arguing for?
And know you don't understand it, Maz, but you are arguing for the de facto creation of a national language by the act of excluding non-English speakers from a large chunk of participating in society. And I know you've deluded yourself into thinking that this exclusion will help them, but when you can't find someone to assist you in your language at a hospital or a government organization or a police station, you're not being helped at all. And why? Because you're part of a minority, and a de facto minority, not a legally mandated one. I thought you were about preserving liberty and protecting the minority against the abuses of the majority.
This ain't it.
You want English to be the official language, pass a law making it so. Otherwise, people have the right to speak whatever language they want, and the government must take care of them anyway. If they have a harder time in society as a result, well, that's their decision, and they are personally responsible for not learning English.
Links please. Or am I correct in assuming you have no idea how much it costs, and that you have no idea how much, collectively, the people who use these service pay in taxes
Ok--
http://www.mnforsustain.org/immg_mn_state_illegals_cost_study.htm
Not even close to paying their way.
Illegals are not the only non-English speakers, swandog. Epic fail.
@maz You can't even move to canada unless you jump through a mile of hoops and promise your first born.
Yeah, those darn Canadians speak Canuck. Can't understand a word they say!
people have the right to speak whatever language they want, and the government must take care of them anyway. If they have a harder time in society as a result, well, that's their decision, and they are personally responsible for not learning English.
I sort of disagree.
I think the gov't should help these people learn english instead of catering every type of service to their native language. We would all be better served if we helped them assimilate and help them help themselves by doing so. Instead of spending tax money to print stuff in 100 languages, why don't we expand (free) perhaps mandatory (or incentivized ?) language training prgrams for new immigrants?
Of course, Critcal (emergency, etc) services should always be multilingual.
Let me clarify...
I think you would find that many immigrants want to learn english, and adopt it as their native language. No one should ever be forced to learn English, but it should be made very clear that those who do learn are opening a whole new set of doors than those that do not learn English and choose to isolate themselves within their ethnic groups.
Illegals are not the only non-English speakers, swandog. Epic fail.
I think it does prove my point, by acknowledging that their are more people than even that study points to shows that the costs are high.
Otherwise, people have the right to speak whatever language they want, and the government must take care of them anyway.
That is the real issue. The government is not hear to take care of anyone. You seem to think that the taxpayer has some moral obligation to support everyone that you deem to be in need. It is not my problem who speaks what. I do not want to pay for it. I don't care if they speak English or not. what I do care about is paying an increase in taxes to support them. You might think it is the role of government to pay for massive services to everyone and at this point some voters agree with you. However, others do not agree with you and they are as organized as your party. I believe in limited government, and do not want to pay for anyone else's language lessons, it is not my problem. If enough people like myself and Mrs. Bachman agree the law will be implemented.
You're still going to need multi lingualism. Even if it were reasonable to expect all recent voluntary immigrants to be functionally literate in English, what about political refugees? What about interpretative services for deaf people that rely on ASL?
Once you start making these things available for certain groups, how are you going to decide that the deaf person deserves interpretative services, but the 60 year old Hmong immigrant doesn't? Or only deserves it for 2 years after arriving? What if the person doesn't have a strong aptitude for learning a new language?
You just start running into so many exceptions and judgment calls, I believe it's simpler and fairer to provide it to anyone that feels they need it.
Am I the only one who finds the use of "illegal" as a noun to be dumb?
You're still going to need multi lingualism. Even if it were reasonable to expect all recent voluntary immigrants to be functionally literate in English, what about political refugees? What about interpretative services for deaf people that rely on ASL?
Once you start making these things available for certain groups, how are you going to decide that the deaf person deserves interpretative services, but the 60 year old Hmong immigrant doesn't? Or only deserves it for 2 years after arriving? What if the person doesn't have a strong aptitude for learning a new language?
You just start running into so many exceptions and judgment calls, I believe it's simpler and fairer to provide it to anyone that feels they need it.
Individuals with disabilities in my opinion are a different situation. No one chooses to be deaf, because of that I think that society should help that individual. However, I do not think that we can afford to help all the deaf people in the world either. Citizenship is the key point in this discussion. An immigrant has chosen or been forced to come to this country. They could choose to go somewhere else. Once someone decides that they are coming to this country they have an obligation to function and pay their own way. I do not think that it is governments job and that is where I respectfully disagree with you. In the end we have to make financial choices i.e. do we pay to help deaf citizens or do we pay for a different social program. We do not have unlimited resources and choices need to be made. I do think that charities and churches should aid in assisting immigrants with in the community. Many of these organizations are the ones that sponsor and bring them over to this country, they and they alone are responsible for their needs not the government.
Give me your hungry, your tired your poor I'll piss on 'em
that's what the Statue of Bigotry says
Your poor huddled masses, let's club 'em to death
and get it over with and just dump 'em on the boulevard
-Lou Reed
"Dirty Boulevard"
from the New York LP.
I. Rest. My. Case.
So essentially, Swandog, you're saying that only immigrants who are well-off should be coming to the U.S.?
Jesus man, does this sound at all familiar to you?
Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,
With conquering limbs astride from land to land;
Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand
A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame
Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name
Mother of Exiles. From her beacon-hand
Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command
The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame.
"Keep ancient lands, your storied pomp!" cries she
With silent lips. "Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"
Many of our ancestors would be dead were it not for the charity and opportunity offered by this country to those who came to its shores with nothing. Now you, and others like you, who have turned those opportunities into success would have the U.S. turn away from those values. It's frustrating to see the same paternalistic attitudes that have engendered so much trouble overseas come home to roost in a new breed of self-centered isolationists.
Besides -- to all those who would make these demands, beware. In 10 years English-speaking Caucasians will not be the majority. How would you like it if the Spanish-speaking majority starts demanding government communications be printed in the dominant language then?
That is the real issue. The government is not hear to take care of anyone.
Guess you don't ever have to go to a hospital, enjoy police protection, firefighters, etc. Somalia is a nice example of no government, see how well it works for them.
This is what happens when you have an individual driving around who can't read road signs because she doesn't know English. She mistakes a STOP sign for a GO sign and the result?
Bus Crash
And to those that doubt going multilingual in government documents is free: you already paid $117,000 to have the Hiawatha line have translating ticket machines in Spanish, Hmong and Somali.
Back up grasshopper. Nobody has suggested, let alone claimed that this is cost free. Just that those who do need these services, by and large, do contribute towards paying for them.
As for the bus crash, reading English has nothing to do with that. A stop sign has a distinct shape and color. No need to be able to read.
I won't be voting to close the border. I enjoy a good Dirty Sanchez too much.
In 10 years English-speaking Caucasians will not be the majority.
Nonsense.
I won't be voting to close the border. I enjoy a good Dirty Sanchez too much.
»» Submitted by Larry Craig at 6:41 PM on April 10
Pitching or catching?
Forgive me, I don't know much about baseball.
But having an English driving test didn't help me, I failed anyway. To many points off for rear endings.
This is what happens when you have an individual driving around who can't read road signs because she doesn't know English. She mistakes a STOP sign for a GO sign and the result?
I believe you're mistaken. STOP signs are, by intention, designed to be understood regardless of language. That is why a STOP sign is the ONLY octagonal road sign used around the world. It can even be recognized for what it is from the back without any color or printing visible.
Also, the color red was adopted internationally to mean "stop," so even if a person doesn't recognize the octagonal shape or is illiterate (I'm sure you know what "arret" means?), the red color should be understood.
I sincerely doubt the issue was that she couldn't read a stop sign. If you were to run this stop sign in Mexico, would it be because you thought "alto" meant "go"?
Is there even such a thing as a "go" sign?
@Derekest
You're reasoning is impaired, just like the driver's judgement. You're masking your xenophobia (and it really IS a fear of strangers) by making an outrageous claim. Literate English-speakers also fail to stop at stop signs. Should we deport them, too, for being criminally stupid?
Americans, generally speaking, are a provincial people. A great number have no interest in what happens outside their country. They've been brainwashed by their own propaganda.
Many of our ancestors would be dead were it not for the charity and opportunity offered by this country to those who came to its shores with nothing. Now you, and others like you, who have turned those opportunities into success would have the U.S. turn away from those values. It's frustrating to see the same paternalistic attitudes that have engendered so much trouble overseas come home to roost in a new breed of self-centered isolationists.
The can all come. However, what you are referring to is a different time in a different place. THEY DID NOT HAVE A WELFARE STATE AT THAT TIME THAT IS MY POINT.
You say welfare state like it's a bad thing.
I love government cheese, or as we called it on the rez commots. The beef stew was good too, but the peanut butter was horrid.
If I recall correctly the labels were in multiple languages.
They used to serve that that government cheese at IPS #88. Yum!
government cheese is so good. Why doesn't the government market that stuff. They could make a pretty penny and I'd definitely buy a block here and there.
I'm with you, Bix...my grandma got that for a while when I was a kid. Also, didn't Liquor Lyle's used to have that gov't cheese (or something similar) out at happy hour?
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