82 Comments:
But... but... how could gold like this not rake in the dollars?
»» Submitted by foof at 12:30 PM on May 4
Heard a local media expert (from the U) say this about four months ago. She said that the Pioneer Press will likely be the only surviving daily -- pretty ironic, after the Par Ridder affair and all the years the Strib openly tried to run the PiPress out of business.
»» Submitted by »»» justpbob at 1:04 PM on May 4
LOL things might be bad but if anybody (local media "experts" or otherwise) thinks Minneapolis won't have a major metropolitan daily newspaper any time soon, or that it won't be called the Star Tribune, you are out of your mind. The paper may not be great, it may not do good reporting, it might be half the staff, but it ain't going anywhere.
»» Submitted by calm down at 1:51 PM on May 4
Hey "calm down", I realize it's in The Post, but you might just want to RTFA.
»» Submitted by grote at 2:13 PM on May 4
good. the mainstream press is terrible.
we should move away from objectivity, like the uk. then there'd be tough reporting whenever the opposition is in power, i wouldn't have to see kersten's column anymore, and our press would be a little more exciting.
but their solution: fire talent and put some videos up on the web.
»» Submitted by yep at 2:50 PM on May 4
Geez, I did read the article. I also read David Brauer's take. And like I said if you think there will be no Star Tribune in Minneapolis you are out of your mind.
»» Submitted by calm down at 3:10 PM on May 4
Think about how the money they pay Katherine Kersten to bitch about immoral video games and scary Muslims could be better spent on getting their shit together! Or on hiring somebody with talent.
Strib citizen journalism piece in today's paper.... Hmm, maybe they were really sussing out future career opportunities. Sorry, we're kinda broke too!
I should hire Blackstone Group restructure my own balance sheet...
»» Submitted by »»» chuck at 3:33 PM on May 4
CD -
Thanks for referencing my MinnPost story. Here's the link:
http://tinyurl.com/5re58l
The major things to me are:
1. Has the Strib failed to meet its debt obligations? The Post says yes, but I'm hearing now. This summer is crunch time.
2. Hiring Blackstone to restructure debt is new news. It makes sense to do this whether bankruptcy looms or not. The question is whether lenders will restructure amid the credit crunch.
3. The financial condition of the paper is old news, at least several months old if you've been following MinnPost and other local sources.
4. It's not entirely clear whether a bank takeover means deep cuts. Ultimately, you want to sell the asset, so there's a real question about making cuts that harm the asset value. Could it lead to a PiPress joint operating agreement? Maybe - the paper would have to be losing so much that the anti-trust stuff would be waived.
A live link to my MinnPost story
Crap - first numbered point in my first post should be:
The Post says yes, I'm hearing no.
If I were charged with restructuring the Strib, first thing I would do is send Sid Hartman and his ridiculously high salary packing. It would save money and improve morale.
»» Submitted by grote at 5:29 PM on May 4
This is the two reasons why the Strib failed as a newspaper:
1. The editors turned the paper's newsroom as the mouthpiece for the DFL elite.
2. Objective Journalism went out the door, replaced with partisan politics with an extreme ideology.
»» Submitted by Big G at 5:54 PM on May 4
that's the first explanation I've seen that didn't somehow involve new media. how, um, refreshing.
»» Submitted by grote at 6:19 PM on May 4
Strib now denies a key part of the Post report - says it's not missed debt payments and hiring Blackstone does not mean bankruptcy.
Not waving away the Post's frame, but I think they're at least several weeks early. As I suspected, they were right about Blackstone but sensational about most of the rest. Surprising, I know, coming from the Post.
My story's been updated, with Strib statement:
Most people who aren't part of the increasingly small Rush Limbaugh/Jason Lewis core audience don't think there's any Strib liberal bias at all, and a good portion of the public see the paper's lack of scrutiny of John McCain, its continued employment of a "conservative" hack like Kersten, and its failure to adequately cover the more despicable acts of the Bush Administration as evidence that it's actually not liberal enough. So, the suggestion that this much-bandied-about, vaguely defined "liberal bias" is to blame for circulation declines is laughable ignorance at best. It's just more bullshit from the mindless, idea-less right-wing lie machine.
»» Submitted by Trumpy at 7:48 PM on May 4
I second and THIRD sending Sid packing. Amen.
»» Submitted by Bx at 7:49 PM on May 4
Looks like Strib drove a little too much traffic to the TC Daily Planet site...
Okay, now, look. Dean Singleton, Pope of the Pioneer, has two strategies:
1) Con rich people into letting them handle their money.
2) Cluster newspapers together and monopolize advertising.
Which he's done successfully for years. How the New Media thing will play out, nobody knows. But I have a question for you: Did the railroads become airlines? They were both in the transport business. So what makes people assume newspapers will make the transition to New Media companies. Probably they won't. They are AFRAID of the internet.
But back to Deano. He bought the Pioneer not to run it but to use it as the hub of a new newspaper cluster. He knew very well what kind of company Avista was. He knew they had bought the Strib to sell it. If he somehow combines both papers, and surrounds them with suburban dailies and weeklies, he'll accomplish the same thing he's done in the SF Bay Area.
Right, Calm Down, there'll always be a Strib in Minneapolis. But it might be a four-sheet skyway give-a-way. And it might be called the Strib, but it will be owned by Dean and/or his successors. (He has MS, you know.)
»» Submitted by patrick daniels at 9:57 PM on May 4
considering all of the years that we St. Paulites got more (and more accurate) St. Paul news from the Strib than we got from the PPress, this would be sad.
City Pages has some scary new details:
http://blogs.citypages.com/blotter/2008/05/strib_bankruptc.php
»» Submitted by Uh oh ... that doesn't sound good ... at 11:34 PM on May 4
I personally think the writing and reporting in the Strib is terrible for the size of market that encompasses the Twin Cities. The english grammar used is juvenile and alot of the articles are simply fluff pieces about midwestern living. The Strib is going against the internet and better figure how to make money from it. Ink on paper is yesterday's news.
p.s. illegal immigrants are assholes
»» Submitted by louaphil at 12:00 AM on May 4
just a thought - i have not bought a sunday paper since they got rid of the tv guide insert....
»» Submitted by ron santo jr at 12:11 AM on May 4
Yawn,
Let the Strib fail. Not using the paper it is printed on will save trees.
Yeah and Kersten is a stupid bitch.
»» Submitted by »»» vlado4 at 1:28 AM on May 5
Also, the ruckus over GTA IV is a fucking comedy.
The game will bring the dark side in everyone. Nooooooo.
Can't wait to play this when it comes out on PC. Hope conservatives haven't succeeded in banning it by then.
»» Submitted by »»» vlado4 at 1:31 AM on May 5
Saw you talk about this (on the sidewalk outside your home?) on KMSP-TV, David. The other teevee stations covered it this weekend as well.
If it's on teevee it must be true!
»» Submitted by »»» justpbob at 7:14 AM on May 5
The joint operating agreement rumor has been circulating for awhile now.
Does anyone know how that works?
Would they share printing & distribution, but keep both newsrooms and other depts? I would guess there would be some dept. overlap that they would have to figure out, but it would seem to be a decent solution.
»» Submitted by CatNotNecessarilyLikingMonday at 7:44 AM on May 5
What about the Murdoch/News Corp. angle? Wouldn't they be likely to dance and sing about the failings of other print outlets, so that they can drive down their price and eventually add them to their holdings?
Railroads did not become airlines because freight rail is way more lucrative than hauling people around. Labor savings alone...
»» Submitted by Lunch! at 7:57 AM on May 5
I don't know why people hate the Strib so much. I actually think taken as a whole, they do a pretty good job. The TV stations and websites certainly don't have the staff to break the sheer volume of stories that the Star Tribune covers. I don't get what people are looking for out of their newspaper, or what existing paper is the standard people wish the Strib would achieve.
The day the Strib stopped running "Nancy" in the comics is the day I began hating them, Jason.
»» Submitted by »»» justpbob at 8:10 AM on May 5
Fair enough.
I couldn't give you an answer, Jason, because I've simply stopped reading it.
I can get local news on the radio.
I get two newspapers delivered. The New York Times on the weekend and the Wall Street Journal daily.
I guess they would be my standards.
»» Submitted by The Rat at 8:11 AM on May 5
Local newspapers are like the school cafeteria. No matter what they do, people are going to whine and complain about it, because it's in the culture to do so.
»» Submitted by »»» kurtis at 8:16 AM on May 5
When we lived in Miami, I thought the Miami Herald was a great newspaper.
I think the corporate culture at the Strib turned it into a soulless, pandering newspaper that didn't seem to know what news was anymore.
»» Submitted by The Rat at 8:20 AM on May 5
Honestly, like ron santo jr., I haven't picked up a Sunday Strib since they dropped their television section. I now buy the Pioneer Press instead.
We get both papers at work, so I stay informed.
»» Submitted by »»» justpbob at 8:26 AM on May 5
In today's paper on the front page: an interesting story on Bob Fletcher, and how the sheriff might end up appointed rather than elected; a nice investigative piece on how the state wasted taxpayer money on a game warden convention; and another good story on how charities are being hurt by rising food prices.
I admire The Rat's honesty in slamming a paper that he admits he doesn't read. Most people who tell me that local TV news is horrible also tell me they never watch. Like any news outlet: there are good stories and there are "pandering" stories.
You need a spoonful of sugar to make the medicine go down. You just have to make sure the balance between sugar and medicine is right.
I would add this to Jason's list of good stories in today's Strib -- it's about local efforts to store wind-generated electricity in batteries.
»» Submitted by »»» justpbob at 8:43 AM on May 5
MNspeak: where a post on the financial health of a local newspaper gets more comments than sports or naked teenagers.
»» Submitted by »»» justpbob at 9:11 AM on May 5
well, i will be discontinuing our weekend service. there was nothing of interest to read this weekend, and 4 inches of advertisements.
»» Submitted by baker. at 9:28 AM on May 5
Thanks to GTA IV's new realism, when G-stringed strippers grind the main character's lap, the player's controller vibrates in response.
That's freakin' awesome.
»» Submitted by »»» baker at 9:32 AM on May 5
I was a Thursday through Sunday subscriber for years and after a while it seems that most of the stories that I was reading had run in the NYTimes 2 weeks before. I called to cancel everything but Sunday, a boy has to have his coupons and x-word puzzles. The person on the phone offered me 26 weeks of Wed-Saturday for an addtional $0.18 a week. I turned them down. Just too much paper to recycle.
We do get the NYTimes everyday and I read local news on the Strib website.
»» Submitted by Mpls Simpleton at 9:35 AM on May 5
As more and more of us read the news online only; more and more Star Tribune staff members will continue losing their jobs. There just isn't the money in the online news world at this point. There probably will never be the money online that there was in print or on-air news.
Not that I'm having a pity party for the Strib; I'm just saying that when as a society we decide that we don't want to pay anything for news, at some point we get what we pay for.
I was a Thursday through Sunday subscriber for years and after a while it seems that most of the stories that I was reading had run in the NYTimes 2 weeks before.
I don't know about the daily paper, but there is no time lag on the Sunday. Many of the big stories in the Sunday Times show up in the same day's Sunday Strib.
»» Submitted by »»» mnblrmkr at 9:42 AM on May 5
I admire The Rat's honesty in slamming a paper that he admits he doesn't read. Most people who tell me that local TV news is horrible also tell me they never watch. Like any news outlet: there are good stories and there are "pandering" stories.
Presumably, they (except the ones that like to lord over the rest of us with their claims that they don't even own a tv) have sampled the offerings in the past, and found them lacking. How often are they required to recheck? With the drumbeat of continuous budget and news staff cuts, a person could make an educated guess that the quality isn't going to be meeting their standards anytime soon.
»» Submitted by »»» mnblrmkr at 9:46 AM on May 5
My problem with the Strib's home delivery has always been the delivery personnel. My door is 30 feet from the street, and the paper was always 25 feet from my door. As if someone was walking down the sidewalk and decided to drop the paper there. Further, it always came after I left for work.
I'm just saying that when as a society we decide that we don't want to pay anything for news, at some point we get what we pay for.
Jason, I think I just fell in love with you. Thank you.
I wonder where MNSpeakers would get half the local news aggregated here if there weren't local newspapers and stations here to provide that information in the first place.
»» Submitted by inothernews at 10:07 AM on May 5
I'd been a NYT subscriber when I lived in NYC, and I took a subscription to the Strib when I moved here in 2005. It was odd, to say the least, to repeatedly find myself on the No. 14 bus, re-reading articles I'd first read weeks before on the E Train.
Still, I kept the subscription until I couldn't rationalize paying $$$ to a newspaper that associates with Katherine Kersten. I'm happy to be back with the NYT, even if I have to go online to read the very few interesting articles in the STrib.
»» Submitted by mike s at 10:27 AM on May 5
Perhaps this is just a romanticized or quaint notion, but my morning coffee and Strib is one of life's simplest pleasures. Maybe it's because my work schedule allows for relaxed mornings, but everyday starts with coffee, the paper, and doing the crossword. I for one do not like imagining a life post-Strib.
»» Submitted by »»» nateek at 10:51 AM on May 5
In general the local media is the c to d - team. All of the news outlets seem to think they are the spokes person for the state and it gets old. They need to report the news, provide us with the facts and keep their opinion in the background. I don't think the strib is a conservative or liberal paper, it is just a poor paper. Colman is a moron and Kristen is a hack and that constitutes their editorial staff, what a joke. They are both charatures of a view point and they parrot that view point. I hope the strib goes broke.
»» Submitted by swandog at 10:53 AM on May 5
They are both charatures of a view point
you ought to know.
»» Submitted by grote at 10:56 AM on May 5
Well, so much for a nice cordial MNspeak morning.
It will be interesting to see how this evolves. It's too bad that Harte came too late to the party as he seems to be pretty straightforward. Avista made some pretty big mistakes early on which could be part of what is increasing their need to make sure that they hold it together as long as possible.
When did we become a society that didn't want to hear the other POV? It's one thing to not agree with someone else's view, but it doesn't make him or her a moron or idiot or whatever the name of the day is.
There are, of course, exceptions to every rule.
»» Submitted by Cat_ at 11:14 AM on May 5
@ Cat -
It's my understanding that in a JOA the two papers would keep separate news and ad sales departments. Everything else could be combined.
A little JOA history.
»» Submitted by »»» miller at 11:47 AM on May 5
I'm a 7-day Strib subscriber and weekly find an article or commentary piece that I'd read previously online. So some of their content is recycled--BFD. It's still worth the cheap price of a subscription.
I live in an apartment and frequently had my paper stolen, but the Strib would always send another at no charge. Their customer service has been faultless, and like nateek I look forward to those mornings when I have time to just peruse the paper, KFAI in the background and bloody mary on the table. Of course, at 29 I'm probably one of the older people here, but I would definitely mourn this daily if it were gone.
»» Submitted by Jared at 11:55 AM on May 5
Of course, at 29 I'm probably one of the older people here
If this is true, I've wildly over-estimated y'alls ages, both when I've met you in person or have read you here.
»» Submitted by »»» nateek at 12:04 PM on May 5
Thanks Miller. I'm not sure if a JOA is the solution or just a patch, but it seems as if it would stem the hemorrage for a bit.
Jared: You're handsome and intelligent. Is it working?
»» Submitted by CatHasNineLivesButDoesNotDiscloseAge at 12:08 PM on May 5
Of course, at 29 I'm probably one of the older people here
You are older than me. When it was 11 years ago.
You're 6 years older than I claim to feel.
»» Submitted by »»» nateek at 12:13 PM on May 5
I'm a 17 year old girl on the internets.
»» Submitted by »»» miller at 12:13 PM on May 5
Of course, at 29 I'm probably one of the older people here
Hey wait, I'm not ready to be "one of the oldest here"...
We canceled our weekend subscription because the billing continually got screwed up and we kept getting collection notices. It got really annoying after the 2nd time. Now if we want a paper, which is not very often, we'll walk to the store and buy one.
I do think having a daily is important in a community of this size.
»» Submitted by mb@work at 12:16 PM on May 5
You could throw a rock from the top of Jared's age as hard as you can in the direction of older and not even land it in my three year radius.
»» Submitted by »»» kurtis at 12:19 PM on May 5
I just act as if I'm 8, I'm really 107.
You're only as old as you feel. And most of you have felt, oh, about 27 to me.
Well, if that's the case, Miller, I'm telling your mom.
»» Submitted by CatLikesToThinkShesStill23 at 12:21 PM on May 5
I'm so old, I remember when we would get a morning and an evening paper.
»» Submitted by »»» indyr at 12:27 PM on May 5
I'm so old, I was the short-pants and cap-wearing newsie who sold it to you, and then burst into a song and dance number about striking.
I'm so old, I was the short-pants and cap-wearing newsie who sold it to you, and then burst into a song and dance number about striking.
So you're 34?
»» Submitted by »»» kurtis at 12:37 PM on May 5
Oh my God. Batman is six years younger than me?
Look at it this way, Max. Batgirl is attracted to older men. Therefore you could totally nail Barbara Gordon.
»» Submitted by »»» richg at 12:41 PM on May 5
Yo Cat, can you drop me an email with your email address at the address in my profile?
Thanks.
»» Submitted by »»» Bixby at 12:42 PM on May 5
Thanks, Rich. That actually does help.
Christian Bale is yummy. And if my being older than he makes me a cougar, I take it back as I hate that term.
Bixby: Sure, but if this is some ploy to get me to tell you my age, it's not going to work.
»» Submitted by Cat_ at 12:50 PM on May 5
At this point, max should be happy if he could nail Alfred.
»» Submitted by »»» justpbob at 12:58 PM on May 5
I'm way bummed about the possibility of the Strib going under. IMHO, it's far better than the PiPress, which regularly recycles the work of those in the newsroom at my weekly community newspaper (Elizabeth Mohr in particular - and we have a crappy Web site and don't upload stories frequently so we know she just reads our papers and writes stories on our topics in the next few days). As far as I can tell, the Strib's reporters actually break news and that, in response to Jason's question, is what I'm looking for in a daily.
»» Submitted by northmetroreporter at 1:00 PM on May 5
Christian Bale is yummy.
Especially if we wrap him in bacon.
»» Submitted by mb@work at 1:02 PM on May 5
To clarify: I should say breaking news is one of the top things I'm looking for in a newspaper. The others are accuracy and relevancy (so no, Kersten's BS doesn't make the cut, but in the name of free speech I can forgive them that.)
»» Submitted by northmetroreporter at 1:02 PM on May 5
What do you kids know about being old? or being a newspaperman? to hell with you.
»» Submitted by Sid Hartman at 1:08 PM on May 5
I'm just waiting for Sid's close personal friends to come to his defense.
»» Submitted by »»» richg at 1:18 PM on May 5
Look at it this way, Max. Batgirl is attracted to older men. Therefore you could totally nail Barbara Gordon.
I'm so old, Ruth Gordon would consider me an older man (if she were still alive, bless her heart).
»» Submitted by »»» indyr at 1:58 PM on May 5
I am pretty certain it won't go under; I find it hard to believe that a major metropolitan newspaper would cease publishing, not in this decade at least. The name alone must be worth some decent scratch.
That isn't to say that there won't be some big shifts and more hard times ahead. But I find it hard to believe that there won't still be a Star-Tribune five years from now. I don't know what size its print run will be, or how much of its content will be in online format only.
»» Submitted by »»» teucer at 3:28 PM on May 5
Scarborough Research Co. - who measures readership, television viewing, etc. just released the 1st quarter ratings for WCCO4, KARE11, Channel 9 and KSTP 5. OUCH! Ratings for all their local television news shows down 15% for the 2nd year in a row.
Why go home and watch Don Shelby when you can get your updates all day long on StarTribune.com.
Traditional media are ALL in trouble!
»» Submitted by Angie Dickenson at 4:13 PM on May 5
Scarborough Research Co. - who measures readership, television viewing, etc. just released the 1st quarter ratings for WCCO4, KARE11, Channel 9 and KSTP 5. OUCH! Ratings for all their local television news shows down 15% for the 2nd year in a row
They are biased and full of fluffy stories about nothing. I think we are past cat in tree, global warming bad ect.. It is poor news and a waste of time. The news casters all seem so preachy and disingenuous. The rating show how little people values their product. Maybe if they did not fill their half hour with pre-made spin videos of the "greatest and latest product we need, they might have an audience. Product placement segment have destroyed the news and they are getting what they deserve.
»» Submitted by swandog at 4:26 PM on May 5
I like the Strib, and hate those idiots in the evening news shows. Talk about dumbing down the news!
»» Submitted by MiddleSpunkCreek at 4:29 PM on May 5
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Strib Sinking?: NY Post: The Minneapolis Star Tribune is on the brink of bankruptcy. Yipe. I think everyone expected it would eventually be a one-paper town, but not that one paper. [via]
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