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»ARCHIVED TALK
No back wages
Posted July 23, 2008
The acquisition last week of magazine publisher Metropolitan Media Group already is proving painful to current and former employees.
Petters Group Worldwide, a Minnetonka-based company that owns Polaroid and has a large stake in Sun Country Airlines, has declined to pay back wages and accrued vacation money to more than 50 Metropolitan Media workers who were either laid off last week or offered new positions at a yet-to-be-named company.
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54 Comments:
And a whole generation-and-a-half is ignorant of or adverse to the value of collective bargaining because Grandpa Reagan went union busting in the name of free-market economics. Hello?! In the face of broadcasting consolidation, I'm thankful to be a part of a unit that has negotiated a good severance package that includes a successor clause.
noodleman has nailed the issue. I was always fairly skeptical of these community lifestyle magazines and their economic viability but it's awful to see what has happened to the employees. There is just no protection for a group of young employees tossed into a really bad job market.
But the media types don't always get it. I remember when some of the Twin Cities suburban community newspapers tried to unionize in the early 1980s and were squashed by management of what was then the Sun-Current group. It was always annoying to then see the group's woman publisher held up as the self-made boss when many of us knew how she badly treated the staff and those who tried to organize. I was at another paper not affiliated with the Sun and she went after us.
It was also annoying when the Guild units at the dailies seemed indifferent to our issues back then. . .
»» Submitted by »»» jmc at 7:41 AM on July 23
As I mentioned in another thread, I've always defended the right of people to form unions because some people need them. But small business owners will always resist efforts by others that will add to the cost of running that small business and the ability to hire and fire as revenues fluctuate. Small newspapers and magazines are on a death watch now it seems, as the internet has captured their traditional readers (it seems). Unionizing now would only be rearranging the deck chairs on the titanic. Jane, people like you, who have been around the block, should be telling these kids the facts of life.
»» Submitted by »»» mazasapa at 7:51 AM on July 23
now, maz, are you saying I'm old?
(you may not get invited to my better late than never 50th birthday)
Twenty-some years ago, when the suburban papers tried to organize, the papers and owners were doing quite well financially. It made sense then had we been able to unionize. I loved my work in the 'burbs but didn't like making $250 a week while the newspaper owners had lake cabins and long weekends off.
now? not the case for print media. but I hate these seeing these young Metro employees losing what little they're entitled to.
»» Submitted by »»» jmc at 7:59 AM on July 23
Unionizing now would only be rearranging the deck chairs on the titanic.
I disagree. The one thing a union can guarantee is some kind of severance package. I was part of a group that organized at StarTribune a couple of years ago. We were still negotiating our initial contract when the company announced that most of our jobs were being outsourced to India. If we hadn't organized, the company could have waited until they had the outsourcing lined up, then given everyone two weeks notice (with no severance package).
Since we were in a collective bargaining situation, we had advance notice of their plans, and the union was able to negotiate a decent package. You're right that the publication industry is facing tough times. But I think it seems like the perfect time to organize.
»» Submitted by »»» miller at 8:36 AM on July 23
Well, maybe. But more likely you'll be expediting the inevitable.
»» Submitted by »»» mazasapa at 8:41 AM on July 23
The one thing a union can guarantee is some kind of severance package.
Only if the company never intended to provide one in the first place. I worked for an outsourcing company serveral years ago that had to close my location because our clients moved their business to Canada and India. We (in operations) received 3 months notice and a 4 week severance package. The entry level gang received the same notice, and I believe they got a 2 week severance package. Plus, they were all guaranteed unemployment and referrals. We were not union.
That was a good job, too. I still mourn it.
»» Submitted by »»» Ang at 8:46 AM on July 23
But small business owners will always resist efforts by others that will add to the cost of running that small business and the ability to hire and fire as revenues fluctuate.
maz, if nothing else, a successor clause would at least have guaranteed these workers some sort of continuity ... including BACK PAY! I'm not saying raise the workers' wages. Just pay them for the work they've already done.
Petter assumed more than $100 million of MMG's debt when he bought the friggin' company. Doesn't he consider THAT "cost?" So what's an extra $200,000 or so for payroll? If that fraction of expense is gonna break the bank for Petter, then he's not a very smart businessman to begin with.
The entry level gang received the same notice, and I believe they got a 2 week severance package. Plus, they were all guaranteed unemployment and referrals. We were not union.
Yes, there are enlightened capitalists in the world. Not many; but some. Consolidation, though, has eliminated many of the locally-owned companies that were so enlightened. (Same thing has happened to the banking industry. The farmer in debt now can't rely on his friendly town banker to give him a month or two of relief. Citibank/BoA/Etc want their money ... now.)
More power to the capitalist overlords who haven't forgotten what it's like to live paycheck to paycheck. Sadly, too many bean-counters are in charge now and they don't give a rip.
It seems that the situation at the former Metropolitan Media Group may be a bit of a precursor to what could happen with other groups. Granted, MMG took a lot of risks with expansion and addition of publications in rather unsure times but for a company to take over with sales of over $2 billion to say that they can't afford to pay back wages and vacation just shows how little value CEOs place on their employees.
»» Submitted by »»» sornie at 8:55 AM on July 23
but for a company to take over with sales of over $2 billion to say that they can't afford to pay back wages and vacation just shows how little value CEOs place on their employees.
And that is especially shortsighted in an industry like print lifestyle magazines where the employees create the value by creating content and selling ads. I know from experience that good sales staff are born not made.
»» Submitted by »»» lunch! at 8:59 AM on July 23
... 3 months notice and a 4 week severance package.
Sorry, but that's not what I'd consider a good severance package. Our union negotiated for a week's pay for every 6 months of service, with a miniumum of 4 weeks pay and a maximum of 52 weeks. Some long-time employees walked away with a check for a full year's pay. Yay union!
»» Submitted by »»» miller at 9:05 AM on July 23
(Same thing has happened to the banking industry. The farmer in debt now can't rely on his friendly town banker to give him a month or two of relief. Citibank/BoA/Etc want their money ... now.)
Unless that local banker was Carl Pohlad.
»» Submitted by »»» Dougie_D at 9:06 AM on July 23
Some long-time employees walked away with a check for a full year's pay. Yay union!
So tell me again why those people deserved a year's pay, free? Did that agreement help the company's chances of surviving or hurt that company's chances of surviving? At least it was a private company and not a government entity. The taxpayers would be a little po'ed I would think.
»» Submitted by »»» mazasapa at 9:16 AM on July 23
Did that agreement help the company's chances of surviving or hurt that company's chances of surviving?
Does it have to be one OR the other?
If the ownership or management thought that such a clause would hurt the company, perhaps they shouldn't have negotiated it.
Deserved? You deserve whatever you can get.
»» Submitted by »»» Rat at 9:20 AM on July 23
I agree with Miller. Three months and/four weeks is a sack of peanuts.
»» Submitted by »»» Rat at 9:22 AM on July 23
Wasn't MMG the company that created the print mag about local radio personalities? Just sayin'.
I don't know the specifics around the purchase, but couldn't MMG have fought for the employees to ensure they would get back pay and vacation?
Petter's, if nothing else, could and should, take care of pay and vacation as a good will measure, but my sense is that the bottom line is more important than good will.
»» Submitted by »»» Cat at 9:23 AM on July 23
Three months and/four weeks is a sack of peanuts.
If you can't find another job with equal or higher pay in 4 solid months of looking, either you're not looking hard enough or you don't deserve to making as much. Getting laid off isn't excuse for a vacation...it's time to find new work.
»» Submitted by »»» g rote at 9:26 AM on July 23
I'd be pretty pissed if that happened to me.
»» Submitted by »»» kwatt at 9:31 AM on July 23
Getting laid off isn't excuse for a vacation...it's time to find new work.
Where did I say that?
»» Submitted by »»» Rat at 9:31 AM on July 23
Well, it wasn't. It was enough time and money that I didn't have to sweat it out looking for another job. And when that job was in another state, I still wasn't worried about money because I was still receiving paychecks. Sure, a year's pay is outstanding but it also seems rather excessive.
Besides, that location had only been open for 4 years. By that formula, the most anyone would have received is 8 weeks pay. We received half of that.
Either way, I wasn't complaining about the severance then. They absolutely had no obligation to give us anything but a wave goodbye. And for an outsourcing company, that was pretty damn good.
»» Submitted by »»» Ang at 9:33 AM on July 23
you called the offer a sack of peanuts.
»» Submitted by »»» g rote at 9:34 AM on July 23
I got laid off/fired from a company after five years. They gave me a month's severance. I thought it was an insult.
»» Submitted by »»» Rat at 9:39 AM on July 23
Bad economies and getting laid off are good life lessons that all people should benefit from. It teaches people the value of having some money socked away. It teaches people that nothing is forever. It teaches people that when you're unemployed, looking for a new job is your new full-time job. I got laid off in april of 2000 when the company I worked for got bought out and moved to new york. Best thing that ever happened to me.
»» Submitted by »»» mazasapa at 9:39 AM on July 23
Maz - I don't know if they deserved the severance pay, but they got it. My point is that union organizing in a declining industry can benefit the worker. Your bargaining position sucks, but at least you're bargaining.
You're right that the company would have been in a better position if they hadn't needed to negotiate the package through the union. But I don't think you can ask a group of people who've just been given notice to care about the company's long-range financial outlook.
»» Submitted by »»» miller at 9:42 AM on July 23
i'm inclined to agree with everything maz just said. also, I'm curious as to how Target has avoided unionizing. seems they are the type of company that would be ripe for union picking.
»» Submitted by »»» g rote at 9:52 AM on July 23
Rat...one man's insult is another man's wake-up call.
»» Submitted by »»» g rote at 9:53 AM on July 23
All this unions/severance/notice talk has gotten us away from the hose job these MMG employees are receiving at the hands of two seriously greedy douchebags: Kenan Aksoz and Tom Petters. What recourse do these employees have in order to get their back pay?
»» Submitted by »»» Mittens at 9:54 AM on July 23
Well, I don't know what they can do about the vacation pay since it's a benefit and companies aren't required to offer it. But the back pay? Doesn't seem like he has a legal right to withold pay for work already performed.
»» Submitted by »»» Ang at 9:56 AM on July 23
clearly you don't know tom petters. he may be rich, and may be a savvy businessman....but he's far from a greedy douchebag.
»» Submitted by »»» g rote at 9:56 AM on July 23
Not paying earned wages when you're sitting on a $2.2 billion company = greedy douchebag in my book. Not sure how you get around that.
»» Submitted by »»» Mittens at 10:07 AM on July 23
If you can't find another job with equal or higher pay in 4 solid months of looking, either you're not looking hard enough or you don't deserve to making as much.
Sorry, I have to call bull shit on this.
This might apply if you're looking for a job as a barista, or bus boy, but the higher your education/longer your experience, the longer it's going to take you to find a job, especially in a down economy like we have right now. My last lay-off, it took me 6 months of solid job hunting to find my current job. Previous lay-offs took 3 and 4 months. I have friends with PhDs that have taken even longer to find new jobs.
The number of companies in your field, your level of experience, ability to relocate are all factors that can greatly extend a job search.
Getting laid off isn't excuse for a vacation...it's time to find new work.
Depending on the circumstances, some time off to re-evaluate, retrain, etc. may be exactly what's needed.
My last lay-off, it took me 6 months of solid job hunting to find my current job.
I know of people who miraculously found a new job just as their unemployment insurance was running out.
»» Submitted by »»» mazasapa at 10:15 AM on July 23
Rat...one man's insult is another man's wake-up call.
For me it was both. But I still resented it.
»» Submitted by »»» Rat at 10:21 AM on July 23
I know of people who miraculously found a new job just as their unemployment insurance was running out.
And I know people that it took 2 years. And that included applying for jobs with 50% pay cuts.
Your vitriol for Petters is misdirected. Petters is trying to rescue a failed company and is currently managing to preserve about 70% of the jobs. Those people who want back pay should go after the former owner, who was the one responsible for the missed wages and benefits in the first place, and whom I assume got a hefty check from Petters.
»» Submitted by »»» g rote at 10:27 AM on July 23
I know of people who miraculously found a new job just as their unemployment insurance was running out.
Considering that unemployment insurance is money that you paid the company, I don't see the problem with it. It's your money, use it when you want it!
»» Submitted by »»» aliecat at 10:59 AM on July 23
Petters is trying to rescue a failed company and is currently managing to preserve about 70% of the jobs. Those people who want back pay should go after the former owner, who was the one responsible for the missed wages and benefits in the first place
Au contraire. Petters bought MMG's debt, too, which, I assume, would include payroll expenses.
Except, they explicitly excluded back pay from the debt that they acquired, as I understand it.
Noodleman...RTFA:
A company spokeswoman said those debts to employees were not part of the acquisition
»» Submitted by »»» g rote at 11:15 AM on July 23
I know of people who miraculously found a new job just as their unemployment insurance was running out.
Further, how many of those jobs were in a related field, somewhat comparable pay, or comparable match for their skill/experience?
So g_rote, you're not on board with basic human decency? If Petters cut Aksoz a huge check, then what's it to him to pay two weeks wages for people he wants to work at his company? How can he expect those employees to have any respect for him or the product? It's patently ridiculous. The guy's a douche.
»» Submitted by »»» Mittens at 11:24 AM on July 23
I'm talking about business principles, and I'm talking about the first hand experience I have working with Petters in charitable endeavors. and feel free to go ask anyone who works for Petters if he's a douchebag. You'll get quite the opposite response. If you want to reflexively hate rich people, that's your hang up.
»» Submitted by »»» g rote at 11:28 AM on July 23
So Aksoz is the douchebag here. Okay. Then his former employees know now who to take to court. If they do so, it's going to cost him more than whatever wages are owed because the state doesn't take kindly to douchebag owners ... or so I'd hope.
I certainly hope the state doesn't get involved with douchebag owners. your feminine hygeine is your own business.
»» Submitted by »»» g rote at 11:34 AM on July 23
Maybe what needs to happen is a system where backwages create an automatic lien on corporate assets. Mechanics and contractors can place liens on your personal property. Try selling a house with out standing taxes: either the seller or the buyer is going to be on the hook in order to allow the transaction to complete.
I didn't RTFA, but if they're owed for work already completed, can't they just go to the MN Department of Labor and file a grievance without having to hire an attorney?
»» Submitted by »»» aliecat at 11:41 AM on July 23
Hey, maybe Petters is great with the "charitable endeavors" but that's not what we're talking about here. Why doesn't he spread some of that much-praised "charity" around to his new employees? Sounds like they're going to need it.
»» Submitted by »»» Mittens at 11:44 AM on July 23
Alie, yep.
»» Submitted by »»» Ang at 11:46 AM on July 23
Alie, they could, but legally, I believe they're just another holder of unsecured debt, and would be at the end of the creditor line.
That's why I suggested that maybe wages need to create an automatic lien against company assets. Any transfer of assets would then have to be used to satisfy the wage obligation.
Wasn't there talk about not using the term "douchebag" anymore? I believe suggested replacements included:
F***rag
F***knuckle
C***stain
»» Submitted by »»» jane at 11:53 AM on July 23
Why doesn't he spread some of that much-praised "charity" around to his new employees?
It's charitable just keeping them on the payroll in spite of their product bleeding red ink. If they can help make the business profitable for Petters, it'll be like a welfare to work program.
»» Submitted by »»» g rote at 12:57 PM on July 23
It's charitable just keeping them on the payroll in spite of their product bleeding red ink. If they can help make the business profitable for Petters, it'll be like a welfare to work program.
The obvious business solution then is to work for free. Payroll is always the major operating expense of any business. If we worked for free, a business would stand a much, much better chance of being profitable for its owners.
So, g_rote, can we see you lead us by example?
P.S. Product-bleeding-red-ink is actually not the fault of the employees. It's the fault of short-sighted product geniuses who understand little of the market they're dealing with. As someone wrote earlier: Wasn't MMG the company that created the print mag about local radio personalities? Just sayin'.
Maybe 15 years ago when we still had real radio personalities in this market. But now, in this era of cloned-and-canned-voice-tracked radio? ROTFLMAO.
And I work in radio.
Interesting back wages story update from Dave Brauer:
ITEM: Some Metropolitan Media Group employees will get back pay and vacation pay after all.
Last week, I reported that local business titan Tom Petters was buying the local-lifestyle-mag chain, but stiffing employees out of a few weeks' pay plus accrued vacation.
The mags themselves are of little consequence, but the Strib's Chris Serres and Mpls.St.Paul's Brian Lambert advanced the story and amplified the reverse-Robin-Hood angle: rich guy screws low-paid grunts.
Now, according to Petters Group spokesperson Andrea Miller, the 39 MMG employees being kept on will get "retention bonuses" equal to their back pay and vacation. The company still has not decided about making whole the 10-15 workers laid off; Miller says that annoucement will be made Friday or Monday.
Did media pressure get the retained workers their cash? Miller insists not. "We weren't able to get the pieces in place quickly enough" to let workers know when the MMG announcement was made, she explains. "Tom Petters, a very active manager in our company, was traveling and we were unable to reach him for confirmation."
Hmm ... OK.
»» Submitted by »»» Cat at 3:13 PM on July 24
»»» = registered user. click on it to see the user's profile.
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