453 Comments:
Chuck and I can attest to how much something like this sucks when it happens to something you pour your heart and soul into, but these are just t-shirts, so its awesome.
Didn't you ask for this very scenario in an interview with CJ?
»» Submitted by »»» tom at 11:31 PM on September 12
I never liked Keillor...
Bring on the "Liberal Comedian Sues Blogger" t-shirts.
»» Submitted by david at 11:58 PM on September 12
Some candidates for the second run of t-shirts:
"Prairie Homeboy Companion"
"P****** H* C********"
"I got sued by Garrison Keillor and all I got was this stupid... nevermind."
»» Submitted by »»» rex at 12:04 AM on September 12
rex you just need a tshirt with the disclaimer on it.
WARNING: This shirt is not associated in any way with Prairie Home Companion, Garrison Keillor, MPR, The Fitzgerald, or anything!
»» Submitted by yup at 12:19 AM on September 12
How about "It's Parody, Stupid!" shirts.
»» Submitted by Phil at 12:42 AM on September 12
My vote -- honor the cease and desist. Don't reprint the t-shirts. Just capitalize on the incredible blogging press you'll be able to drum up with this -- I just got here via Waxy Links, if that tells you anything. Print up new t-shirts that say "This t-shirt makes Garrison Keillor look extremely out of touch." (or one of a million relevant slogans that would sell better) Step 3: Profit!
Seriously. C&Ds like this are a plague. Publicize it and fight it as your act of civil service for the month.
»» Submitted by Adam at 1:40 AM on September 13
I totally agree with Adam. Abandon any foolish pride over the issue and triumph with another clever product, while simultaneously sitting back in your chair and allowing the blogosphere to validate your stance against such absurdity.
»» Submitted by »»» alexis at 2:02 AM on September 13
I wanna see some blood.
I'm willing to donate 5 dollars (and US dollar$ at that) for your legal fees.
»» Submitted by you at 2:11 AM on September 13
Talk with Garrison. Let him know you're a person of reason. Tell him you'll pull the shirts off the market if he would agree to (finally) trim his nose hair.
»» Submitted by Ron at 2:19 AM on September 13
One problem with your comments to Keillor's counsel is that "out of touch" is kind of the coin of his client's realm, no?
»» Submitted by Jason at 2:14 AM on September 13
I'm no Garrison Keillor fan club member, but just because someone doesn't start slapping his knees and going, "Ho, isn't that the word from those rap songs?" isn't itself qualification for 'humorless.'
»» Submitted by John Gorenfeld at 2:24 AM on September 13
Your parody defense is shot to hell since your sole intention is to make money selling TShirts using a derivation of their trademark. But be sure to continue digging your hole a lot deeper.
»» Submitted by You're fucked. at 2:22 AM on September 13
p.s. That last guy may have been a member of the Garrison Keillor Fan Club, though.
»» Submitted by John Gorenfeld at 2:29 AM on September 13
That's not accurate. The product being commercial is one of four factors considered in acts of parody, but it's just one, and certainly not a case-closer. The Two-Live Crew / Pretty Woman case set the precedent.
But I'm not going to debate the legalities (or for that matter, the aesthetics) any further here, because that's an endless hole.
»» Submitted by »»» rex at 2:29 AM on September 13
Boom.
http://blogs.citypages.com/
ctg/2005/09/keillor_halts_m.asp
Damn, as a fan I'm disappointed. Here's the tactic I hope will be tried. People in the Twin Cities should go to the weekly broadcast, and use the "notes to home" cards they get to write wry protests. The object should be to make fun of the legal moves in the spirit of the show (i.e. to be good enough to air, even if they don't).
I dunno. I guess there's an admission and supporters won't want to give any money to them right now.
I still crave the idea of Keillor reading over the air a note like "To Rex in Minnesota ... don't let those big-city lawyers get the better of you ... we'll still give you the shirt off our back" &c.
I'm a fan, too, by the way. Keillor is way more of a genius in my book than Altman.
But I'm not going to debate the legalities any further here, because that's an endless hole.
Isn't that what all this unused space is for? Let the masses decide!
But seriously, I'd drop the issue.
»» Submitted by »»» alexis at 3:04 AM on September 13
Since this is a community site, maybe I should put it up to a vote.
»» Submitted by »»» rex at 3:16 AM on September 13
Looks like there's already a wikipedia entry about it...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garrison_Keillor
»» Submitted by Andrew at 3:17 AM on September 13
Obviously, Garrison did not start his day with ketchup. Ketchup has natural mellowing agents that help keep you out of these lose-lose PR nightmares.
Ketchup, for the good times.
This wasn't "lose-lose" for Keillor. Rex, it seems, gave him a shot to let this quietly die.
Ymmm... ketchup.
»» Submitted by Doug at 3:40 AM on September 13
A similarly absurd case went to court in 2000. Starbucks sued a cartoonist for selling t-shirts parodying their logo and image.
That case found the cartoonist was NOT infringing on Starbuck's trademark, but he was tarnishing their logo because it said "Consumer Whore." So he was allowed to continue the parody, but not able to profit from it.
I'm just glad I got my shirt before it became a collector's item. :-)
»» Submitted by »»» chuck at 4:33 AM on September 13
At USPTO.gov you can check the metioned trademark registrations.
They are all in the name of KEILLOR, GARRISON
2,542,909 shows:
International Class: 035
On-line ordering services featuring clothing, books, audio tapes, compact discs, videos, mugs, framed prints and posters, plaques, throws, doormats, towels and novelties
First Use Date: 1999-07-01
First Use in Commerce Date: 1999-07-01
»» Submitted by Cole at 4:18 AM on September 13
Link was lost: or http://tarr.uspto.gov/
»» Submitted by Cole at 4:39 AM on September 13
You should submit this to Chilling Effects.
I went through a similar situation as webmaster for the band Beatallica, and learned a few things:
- Even if you think your use is "fair use", the only way you can prove it is to go to court, and copyright infringement cases typically cost $100,000-$200,000. The system is financially slanted towards copyright holders.
- The more publicity you can get, the better. Shame the bastards, and they'll back down.
Also contact the Electronic Frontier Foundation, which helps defend people against this kind of threat. They did quite a number on Ludlow Music's suit against Jibjab for their parody of "This Land is Your Land".
War in Iraq, Floods covering the South, and the biggest issue I'm hearing out of Minnesota is a radio host upset about 10 t-shirts. What a lamer. God, this guy must be really out of touch with people outside his age group.
»» Submitted by James at 5:53 AM on September 13
Anyone got an email for the liberal comedian or his lawyer? I'd like to email him what I think of this bull shit. What an asshole this guy really truely is.
»» Submitted by Johnny at 5:46 AM on September 13
From the letter above the email address of the lawyer appers to be 'eric.nillson@lawyer.com'
Worth a quick polite mail asking him to pass on congratulations to his client on getting known worldwide as a silly old man.
(ref: metafilter)
»» Submitted by matthew at 7:26 AM on September 13
There's an interesting case of a company suing a friend of mine who's a blogger going on over at seobook.com. The situation has been slashdotted and covered on Wired, NYT, WSJ, etc.
»» Submitted by Lee at 7:02 AM on September 13
Further to the above I sent:
Dear Sir,
I believe you act for Garrison Keillor.
Would you be kind enough to pass on my congratulations to him for appearing as a very silly old man for his copyright defence. It certainly brightened my day, and amused me more than any of his books.
Had he not pursued someone who writes a very minor blog I might never of heard of the whole silly dispute.
Could he approve of a t-shirt saying Prairie Gnomes Nose Companion for me to market worldwide on ebay to promote my new nasal hair clippers?
Yours etc
»» Submitted by matthew at 7:37 AM on September 13
Put legalities aside (because legalities have nothing to do with truth, morality or decency).
I don't think your shirt was malicious, it was very light "ha ha" kind of thing. I think if you become vindictive or stir up trouble (already happened now) then you are being malicious. Its a small matter as you say, so I wouldn't milk it or fight it.
From his point of view I think its perfectly possible that somebody could have seen the shirt and actually thought that PHC was making some rap joke. I don't think anybody thinks somebody would BUY the shirt not realizing, but it would be easy to just see it on the street and think that PHC was trying to make some hip joke. (and coming from them, this joke would just seem weak. its not their style).
You see it as a hip intertextual thing that enhances them (like sampling). But that's how you think. PHC fans don't think like that, they don't get "culture sampling".
Leave them alone, they are nice enough people (like a pleasant relative : you don't make off-color jokes just to rile them up).
In a time of cultural war you should support those who are doing good. don't fuck with Keillor, he ripped norm coleman a much needed new asshole. the liberal world tends to rip each other up over little nothings.
also, it is so endlessly funny to juxtapose straight whitey with black "funky" hip-hop tropes ? I mean its a staple of sitcom humor, and its a staple of the 'clever white guy' world. but methinks that shit is plaaaaaayyyyyed out.
»» Submitted by felix at 7:20 AM on September 13
Who is going to get the joke? Does anyone using the term "ho" even aware of the show Prairie Home Companion? I'm curious as to what audience would actually find the shirt funny.
»» Submitted by jjones at 8:05 AM on September 13
OH SCHNAPPLE!! This is the best thing that could've happened.
»» Submitted by »»» taylor at 8:54 AM on September 13
The one thing I see in the C&D letter that you didn't mention in your entry was "your use of aprairiehomecompanion.org". That site doesn't go anywhere for me. Can you comment on what's up with that?
»» Submitted by Dave at 8:56 AM on September 13
First thing's first: DON'T TAKE LEGAL ADVICE FROM STRANGERS ON THE INTERNET!
»» Submitted by js at 8:59 AM on September 13
No one really likes the PHC show anyway.
»» Submitted by M at 8:57 AM on September 13
Is there anythingpreventing you from doing a new shirt?
Parody is Spelled
G a r r i s o n K e i l l o r
Parody of a Libel provided by Garrison Keillor
Has a nice ring to it..
»» Submitted by Fred Grott at 9:16 AM on September 13
People, please stop confusing trademarks with copyright.
»» Submitted by Mensa at 9:20 AM on September 13
Freedom of Speech: Just watch what you say.
Isn't weird how people are supposed to be allowed to express themselves... until some liberal douche-bag decides that it's somehow "offensive" to someone?
Who the hell could get confused anyway. I'll guarantee the vast majority of Americans have no idea who the hell Garrison Keillor is.
»» Submitted by Clarence Anderson at 9:30 AM on September 13
As your attorney, I advise you to step up production of these shirts, and continue selling them through the aforementioned "aprariehomecompanion.org" domain name.
»» Submitted by esquire at 9:10 AM on September 13
We support you, Rex! Parody will always triumph over curmudgeonism.
Liberals......always in favor of supporting, defending free speech. Unless of course it offends them. Should be interesting to see how the ACLU roars into action to protect the first ammendmet rights of the......I'm dreaming again.
»» Submitted by Gen. Iron Guts Kelly at 9:47 AM on September 13
Mensa has a good point. Campbell is a copyright case. There is another case out there about a humor magazine that parodied a beer company in a fake ad. I think the beer company was Miller. Anyone recall the name of the case? I don't even remember the outcome. So the first issue would be if fair use for parody extends to trademark protections.
Also: about two or three years ago Tonya Harding sued a maker of "novelty foods" who had created a product labelled "Tonya Harding Hot Sauce" that had caricature of Tonya Harding on the label depicting her as, well, how should we say... White Trash. I think that case settled.
»» Submitted by Tanker J.D. at 9:44 AM on September 13
Don't cave. Parody is protected and Keillor should go spin.
»» Submitted by Brian at 9:55 AM on September 13
The Starbucks case cited by Chuck, above, seems to be similar facts based on the the Salon.com article. I couldn't find the ruling on Westlaw, though.
»» Submitted by Tanker J.D. at 10:02 AM on September 13
isn't prairie home companion itself a parody? not a very funny one, but a sort of warm fuzzy one. too bad no home-towny radio dude sued Keillor out of existence back in the day, hey?
»» Submitted by :dotty at 9:52 AM on September 13
Lame response to a mediocre parody. This is stupid and not funny at the same time.
»» Submitted by liono at 9:59 AM on September 13
Perhaps the next one should read "A Parody Home Companion"?
»» Submitted by Erica at 10:22 AM on September 13
Not sure what sucks more, PHC or your lame T-shirt.
"Help, help, I' being opressed."
»» Submitted by Not amused at 10:22 AM on September 13
Keep in mind, everybody, that trademark law and copyright law are two very different things. This case has nothing to do with copyright. It's all about the trademark. So when you're doing your Google searches, don't even bother looking up copyright issues, because they are not relevant to this case.
»» Submitted by Jake at 10:19 AM on September 13
metafilter
Somebody (with an account) should explain the 'backstory' to those nosy amateurs.
»» Submitted by Morcambe at 10:36 AM on September 13
First of all I think that shirt is a riot. I have sent this link to all my Midwest friends back in Chicago and in Dallas, TX. So I'm spreading the news. I'll keep checking and hope that you start selling the shirt again. Keep up the good work.
»» Submitted by Jim in Tennessee at 10:44 AM on September 13
I think it should be desisted just on the basis that it's not even clever. You dropped the letters ME to make the word HO. How long did that take to think up? Real headline should be Comedian Sues to Stop Painfully Unfunny Humor
»» Submitted by andy at 10:34 AM on September 13
I don't think the guy has a legal case. But what's even more embarassing is that he thinks such a completely lame parody is nontrivial enough to warrant attention. Prarie Ho Companion? That's just dumb in the first place. If you're going to get sued, maybe it should be over something more clever.
»» Submitted by Webegone at 10:50 AM on September 13
One side y'all may not have considered:
If you have a trademark, you ARE OBLIGATED to ACTIVELY defend against any possible infringement. If you do not jump on infringements, you can be SOL later when someone really infringes, because the infringer can point to your failure to go after earlier infringements, causing you to lose rights to the tradmark.
So, Keillor & Co have to do something. hence the C & D letter.
Just sayin'.
»» Submitted by bystander at 10:48 AM on September 13
Of course he's clueless -- the man just got a cell phone and wrote a Strib column about it. We should cut the old, befuddled, funny guy a break.
Hell, maybe it was his attorney (billing at $300+/hour) who talked him into it.
»» Submitted by Rob at 10:52 AM on September 13
I'm glad he's suing you, as you're clearly a dick. Now, if you had pointed out his lawyer was wrong in suing you, that would be one thing. Garrison probably knows nothing about this... but, I guess this is a good way for you to get hits on your site.
Please send all flames to martelthehammer@gmail.com
»» Submitted by Kevin Horner at 11:08 AM on September 13
While I like the idea of fighting the man, even when "the man" in this case is a comedian whom I enjoy, some perspective is in order. A holder of a trademark is required by law to defend it. While your operation is small and poses no threat to Keillor's brand, if they didn't pursue legal action it would open them up to trouble down the road. I don't have the legal source handy, but it is possible for another entity to cite lack of diligence defending a trademark in the past as a reason that they too should be allowed to profit from Keillor's IP.
I don't much care for this arrangement, but the guy has spent 30 years making A Prairie Home Companion a household phrase, at least among English majors. His lawyer is less worried about your minor infringement than he is worried about creating an opening for the big offender. Don't take it too personally.
»» Submitted by Duane at 11:03 AM on September 13
Congrats on your exposure. I linked here from Boortz's news page today.
I think the T-shirt is extremely funny (and I have found Keillor funny from time to time, too) Good luck with what ever you decide to do.
»» Submitted by JRD at 10:50 AM on September 13
You're done for, dude. Every rest home resident and retired professor emeritus in the mid-west is gunning for your ass now.
Are Keillor's Lutheran jokes good stuff or what? And that line about every kid being above average in Lake Wobegon? Just doesn't get old.. (Maybe we could countersue on the grounds of defective comedy...)
»» Submitted by yo-dawg at 11:14 AM on September 13
I would advise getting in touch with someone at adbusters.org
they've done that kind of thing before.
A trademark is tied to the design styles that are used to represent it as far as
»» Submitted by marko at 11:36 AM on September 13
Even within the public broadcasting industry, Keillor is considered something of a putz.
»» Submitted by Knows firsthand at 11:41 AM on September 13
Wow, so much hate! Am I the only one here who loves both MNSpeak and A Prairie Home Companion?
»» Submitted by chuck t at 11:31 AM on September 13
"We hereby demand that you immediately adandon all use of "A Prairie Home Companion."
Ha!
»» Submitted by Doug at 12:00 PM on September 13
How about
G a r r i s o n K e i l l o r is a Ho and not my companion.
G a r r i s o n K e i l l o r used to be funny.
G a r r i s o n K e i l l o r: Stupid White Guy
»» Submitted by wyck at 11:58 AM on September 13
It seems like he has a good case. Minnesotans are morons, so I can see them being confused by this.
»» Submitted by Gene at 12:05 PM on September 13
You know what's going to happen? In a couple of months, you'll be listening to APHC and as you listen to the News from Lake Wobegon, you'll realize that the story Keillor is describing is really about you and the T-shirt. That's how he communicates with the outside world. It's spooky.
»» Submitted by chuckjr at 12:04 PM on September 13
Um, I've only found PHC marginally amusing, but it does improve upon the painfully unfunny shirt causing the brouhaha.
I look forward to other franchise dilutiing offerings to come: Ho Alone. Ho Improvement. Ho Magazine. ET Phone Ho. Comedy Gold.
For your follow up? Type 1134 on your calculator and then turn the monitor upside down! Genius!
»» Submitted by 99 at 12:22 PM on September 13
The lawyer and author of the letter is Keillor's wife's ( that is, 2nd and much younger wife) brother, scion of a nice, next-door, middle class Anoka family that numbers among its clan three classical violinists (including said wife #2). They were in high school together so he probably did it on spec or even pro bono. Even he used to play the violin.
I want a T-shirt!
»» Submitted by jDubya at 12:25 PM on September 13
Why don't you use your brain and come up with something original on your own and quit trying to ride on the backs of people who HAVE an original thought?
Garrison Keillor has a perfect right to ask you to stop.
»» Submitted by Lee at 12:32 PM on September 13
This is truly outrageous. When will the Duct Tape stand up and sue for the years of Prairie Home infringement they've endured?
And Ketchup. And Powdermilk! I think if they joined forces, they'd be able to ravage the prairie like a swarm of locusts.
Now the news from Lake Sue-the-blogger: where all the women are strong smelling, all the children are above each other, and all the men are good suers.
»» Submitted by jojo at 12:26 PM on September 13
Hmm....I'm pretty sure there hasn't actually been an orginal thought in quite some time.
It's interesting that people are more up in arms about this than the 15% voter turnout we will probably have in Mpls/St P for the primaries.
»» Submitted by doug at 12:40 PM on September 13
You MUST realize that the 1st Amendment only gurantees freedom of speech for well-heeled, limousine-liberals and completely mindless idiots, and that the legal profession is fully staffed by BOTH.
I would LOVE to see some other lawyer shove this one right back in his face, but barring that - the bad publicity for the ever-sensitive Garrison is a close second.
I'd love to be on the jury for this one.
»» Submitted by Another Rex at 12:21 PM on September 13
used to like him, now he's a dick. kinda like clinton.
»» Submitted by bob at 12:54 PM on September 13
two words: male menopause
»» Submitted by anne at 12:53 PM on September 13
endlessly funny to juxtapose straight whitey with black "funky" hip-hop tropes ?
This reminds me of the sequence in The Wire where the two young, black Baltimore gang members steal a car and listen to "the News from Lake Woebegone" on a long drive because that's what happens to be on. Utter classic.
Note to conservative visitors: MNSpeak and PHC are both liberal by any meaningful standard. Did this get linked by Little Green Footballs or something?
copy of email sent to phc@npr.org :
I am a big fan of the program. I have the 25th Anniv. cd
Do you have have t-shirts? I am interested in the one of the 'HO' shirts.....
Thanks. Bill
»» Submitted by Bill Thomas at 1:01 PM on September 13
I hope Garrison Keillor doesn't find out we have an old iron mine filled up with water near Gilbert, MN named Lake Ore-Be-Gone!
»» Submitted by »»» srhcb at 1:29 PM on September 13
Mr. Keillor worked hard to build the name and you should respect that. I am a democrat but I am becoming increasingly concerned that you jerkoff liberals have no respect for others hard earned property when push comes to shove, you will steal it.
»» Submitted by Take a hike at 1:20 PM on September 13
Ummm, I'm not so sure you have a slam dunk case against Garrison Keillor. The use of "Ho" in place of "Home" can easily be shown as a pejorative term designed to dilute and devalue his trademark. I realize you didn't stage a huge marketing campaign and sell tons of t-shirts but the fact that you sold anything indicates that you are profiting from it which means your t-shirt could be seen as a commercial parody as opposed to a non-commercial one, (see Campbell v. Acuff-Rose Music).
»» Submitted by my2cents at 1:29 PM on September 13
How about?
Liberal Comedian Sues Some Dumb Guy Selling Bad T-Shirts?
»» Submitted by dumb at 1:47 PM on September 13
Liberal or not, Garrison Keillor built The Prairie Home Companion from the ground up and made it a commercial success for more years than you have been alive. Your derogatory T-shirt is not particularly humorous NOR successful, but it is based on the title of Keillor's show, and thus makes a false association between your not-terribly-clever effort and Keillor's decidedly successful property.
So... Cease and desist, like the man said. You yourself admitted that the T-shirts were a lousy investment, so what is the purpose of defending your failure? Unless, of course, you're just grandstanding to see your name in the same paragraph with Garrison Keillor's.
CM
»» Submitted by Charles Miller at 12:53 PM on September 13
Rex-
Print more.
»» Submitted by Mike at 12:56 PM on September 13
In response to Pete:
Note to conservative visitors: MNSpeak and PHC are both liberal by any meaningful standard. Did this get linked by Little Green Footballs or something?
Maybe not Little Green Footballs but powerlineblog has the story. Always nice to hear from the "hindrocket".
»» Submitted by Brian at 2:04 PM on September 13
Naw, dog. The title of this blog post should have been "Lake Ho Begone"
»» Submitted by Ben Donley at 2:10 PM on September 13
T shirt suggestion-
Garrison Keillor: Aging Hippie Liberal Douche
»» Submitted by PHC bores me at 2:10 PM on September 13
If you send them a letter claiming that you don't feel you infringe based on fair use (satire), or if you ask permission, I feel confident they would send you a response stating that they accept your position and reserve the right to take further action.
These letters are a part of doing business. The problem is that if a real megacorp (like Walmart) can prove that they aren't defending their trademarks, then Walmart can ignore their trademarks.
If you want to fight someone, fight the legislation that require this kind of horseshit and create unreasonable barriers to small businesses.
Taking a dump on a radio program accomplishes nothing.
Also, if Garrison Keillor is a "mega-gigantic media empire", what is Rupert Murdoch.
Cheers.
»» Submitted by IANAL at 1:57 PM on September 13
drop the posturing, make amends, or even apologize.
this got on some public radio mailing lists, and some people are talking about organizing to write to your sponsors. that would actually trip you up, no? i'm sure he has a bigger fan base than you do.
»» Submitted by think it over at 2:07 PM on September 13
"I am a democrat but I am becoming increasingly concerned that you jerkoff liberals have no respect for others hard earned property when push comes to shove, you will steal it."
"Democrat"...you keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
»» Submitted by Don MacDonald at 1:57 PM on September 13
Recognizing there is a delicate balance between Free Speech and defamation or misuse of names, trademarks and other intellectual property, "Parody" has a specific definition under the law.
About ten years ago, the MN Legislature modified our laws making it quite a bit easier for companies to protect their intellectual property. The new law was partly precipitated by the case of Road Kill Helper and Spotted Owl Helper, where Betty Crocker sued to stop the company from selling a product encroaching upon "the good name" of their product, Hamburger Helper.
Nowdays, the original boxes are collectors items:
http://www.i-can-fix-it.com/roadkill/
»» Submitted by »»» srhcb at 2:19 PM on September 13
Haha!!! These posts are a hoot!
Keillor, you suck!!
»» Submitted by Ubermensch at 2:21 PM on September 13
Geez, I'm torn.
On one hand, if he has the law on his side, as much as it sucks that's the way it goes. Witness the Dysfunctional Family Circus which was sued out of existence.
HOWEVER, with that said, please let me go on record that no one, and I mean no one, did I mention NO ONE loathes Mr. Keillor more than I do.
»» Submitted by Admin Worm at 2:44 PM on September 13
I think Keillor is very funny. Everyone in my nursing home listens to PHC.
»» Submitted by yo-dawg at 2:41 PM on September 13
Yo-Dawg, that was extremely funny. I imagine the home saves $$$ on sedatives on Saturday afternoons by switching on NPR.
»» Submitted by Admin Worm at 2:53 PM on September 13
Nilsson, schmilsson. Wonder if Keillor's lawyers are paid with public money like Garrison.
Rex's mistake was to not hit the taxpayers up for a little seed capitol, build his empire on the public dole, then suddenly decide he's a bigshot capitalist, with lawyers n' all, like GK.
If there was any justice in the world, anybody that could show a W-2 for the past 20 years would have a legitimate ownership claim on all the crap that PHC has produced. It wouldn't have been produced if Uncle Sugar hadn't taken your money away at gunpoint (a/k/a the income tax), and decided they know better what to do with it. (give it to Public Broadcast Ho's like Garrison Keillor)
I say, go for the big brass ring, Rex. Prove to the world that if you suck at the public tit, your "work" belongs to the public domain. Hope you don't get a liberal democrat judge at your trial, though.
»» Submitted by Rick at 2:43 PM on September 13
Man, people sure are touchy about this shirt. Do you even know the history behind it?
'Prairie Home' spoof fits its creator to a T - "It was linguistically funny to drop a couple of letters," says Sorgatz. "But I don't mean anything by it. It came from cheekiness about the movie being made and stars being in town."
AFAIK, it wasn't so much a rip on the show or Keillor, but on the insanity of the news media (CJ) and the daily gossip about the stars in the movie (Lohan).
Maybe "Save Rex" or "Free MNSpeak" should be the next shirt!
»» Submitted by »»» moe at 2:55 PM on September 13
The above comments cover the most important point - that a copyright or trade-mark must be consistantly defended, or it's void.
That being said, I must admit that it wasn't until after I moved out of Minnesota that I realized that people thought he was telling jokes,
»» Submitted by David Driscoll at 2:35 PM on September 13
Now that you've garnered some attention, simply change the wording in a new shirt:
"GK sleeps with prairie whores"
»» Submitted by alternates at 2:54 PM on September 13
You are absolutely in the right here. I like Garrison Keillor, and I think your T-shirt is inane, but that doesn't matter. You are still right.
I don't read blogs (see "inane" above); I found you on Findory. Even if you stopped now, you will have won the battle. The only reason to keep this up is what one of your emailers said about C&D orders being a plague upon the land, a legal form of bullying. Thanks for standing up to them
I don't get the parody. What "A Prairie Ho Companion" mean?
»» Submitted by The Rat at 3:05 PM on September 13
I would totally buy a t-shirt that just said: "WARNING: This shirt is not associated in any way with Prairie Home Companion or Garrison Keilor"
Hell, I'd buy 5.
»» Submitted by Trendware at 3:25 PM on September 13
I listen to Garrison every week. Without fail. Love the show. Disagree with his politics, but still love the show. I find it funny that he would issue a C&D for your little T-shirt. I think you ought to tell his lawyers to pound sand and sell your last 10. I'll buy one and wear it while I listen to his show. And, I'll contribute to your law fund.
»» Submitted by Bill Sirmon at 3:11 PM on September 13
Rex -- as a long time fan of Fimoculous, I am wondering if you are planning to send GK a "You are so off my buddy list" T-shirt as a peace offering?
»» Submitted by Dave Pacey at 3:37 PM on September 13
"It was linguistically funny to drop a couple of letters"
Sheesh, does it make you feel smart to use awkward college-speak in describing a silly t-shirt? How about "Dood, we said 'HO.' It's FUNNY."
»» Submitted by Jones at 3:43 PM on September 13
for a lark, take the last 10 shirts, and, in big ol' fat red letters, write "Banned as per Liberal Lawsuit" across the front, then post them up on eBay.
And you could even state that the proceeds would be donated. I think the dilemna of them attempting to sue a person who's raising money for a worthy cause might result in an explosion.
»» Submitted by Ren at 3:56 PM on September 13
"I'll even write the headline for you: 'Liberal Comedian Sues Blogger.' Do you really want that?"
That made me laugh a lot when I saw it on WarrenEllis.com. Now I read the comments on this page, and...
...A bunch of NPR listeners threatening to band together to infringe on someone else's free speach, because it parodies something they enjoy?
That sad. You're forces of evil on the side of good.
»» Submitted by Brandon at 3:38 PM on September 13
Attorney Nillson's writing style is rather constipated, isn't it? The lack of an earlier reference to aprairiehomecompanion.org makes me wonder whether he was cut-and-pasting, not too carefully, from a cease & desist (redundant) letter originally sent to someone else in an unrelated dispute.
Without regard to the merits, or whether Keillor might or might not ultimately win his lawsuit, the transaction costs for both sides in litigating can quickly skyrocket. Among the risks faced by the defendant is that even when the plaintiff can't prove he lost money or suffered any other specific damages (e.g., to reputation), he might still be awarded his attorneys' fees for proving up the violation of his rights. Tread carefully.
»» Submitted by Beldar at 3:36 PM on September 13
"Legally I have no doubt where I stand"?
Heh. You should. Because your shirts are pretty clearly infringing use.
1 - They are intended to make a profit.
2 - they are intended to dilute the brand.
If he wants you, he's got you.
If you'd just quietly, politely played chicken, instead of giving attitude to the lawyer, you'd probably have gotten away with it. But here you are, instead, demonstrating that your intent was to dilute the brand.
Don't confuse your own idea of right and wrong with standing under the law. That's a good way to end up broke and broken.
»» Submitted by eric at 4:04 PM on September 13
the "PR" has begun - the Pioneer Press has a blurb on their site
»» Submitted by »»» rachael at 4:38 PM on September 13
I just asked for his side of the story through his website...
You can reach it here.
Jesus. Does everyone love seeing their own typed words so much that they'll even respond to something so benign, trivial, and assinine, often with NOTHING new to say? I think there are probably more important things to work ourselves in a tizzy over than some "liberal" suing a blogger.
»» Submitted by Cindy at 4:50 PM on September 13
Firstly, Why does this have to become a "Bash Garrison Keilor" board? Garrison Keilor is decent guy and an incredibly talented storyteller and comedian. I have enjoyed "A Praire Home Companion" for a number of years.
Secondly, why is this a matter of Liberal versus Conservative?
This has noting to do with political stance. The matter here is that Keilor saw his creation being defamed and acted to protect it. Who wouldn't?
If you want to create a product and make money, that's fine. Come up with something catchy and original; Don't do it on the backs of other people's creations.
»» Submitted by Dave at 4:36 PM on September 13
You may want to contact the South African site Hellkom which was taken to court on a similar type of issue by Telkom the company they were parodying, and they had the case withdrawn. Their was a similar instance with another South African company making parody t-shirts too but I can't recall their url.
I know it's a different country and different laws, but it can't hurt to see what the principle is that they argued.
»» Submitted by Adrian at 4:58 PM on September 13
It sounds like someone hasn't been taking their ketchup lately. I hope Peter Ostroushko gets to do the bumper music for Court TV when this airs.
»» Submitted by Ed at 4:58 PM on September 13
Keillor does have to defend his trademark, that's a principle of trademark law. Don't take it personally. Look at it this way: the shirts were funny--now they are collectable and funny.
»» Submitted by a reader writes at 5:11 PM on September 13
this is going to get national and probably international media attention. if you own any gk stock, sellsellsell!
»» Submitted by anne at 5:10 PM on September 13
"Any $15 donation gets a free 'A Prairie Ho Companion' T-shirt."
»» Submitted by rone at 5:24 PM on September 13
The biggest hoot is that poor old GK won't talk politics anymore because he is too depressed about the state of politics in this great country.
»» Submitted by Still Searching for a Happy Liberal at 4:59 PM on September 13
*snip* Does everyone love seeing their own typed words so much that they'll even respond to something so benign, trivial, and assinine, often with NOTHING new to say?*snip*
heh heh, Cindy said "ass"
dropping the "inine" from it is linguistically funny...
»» Submitted by Mr. Ned at 5:19 PM on September 13
You'll have to excuse my Freudian slip.
»» Submitted by Cindy at 5:59 PM on September 13
Well, I found out about this over at Reason, so it looks like even the libertarians are having some fun with this. Personally, I wouldn't know who Garrison Keillor was if he dropped dead in front of me. This is probably the most publicity the silly old putz has had in his life.
If you get around to printing off any more of those shirts, I'll take three of 'em!
»» Submitted by V at 5:45 PM on September 13
"He's got a copyright interest in the name and he just wants to protect it nothing personal," Nilsson said.
Sheesh, even the lawyers don't understand the difference between trademark and copyright now. WTF?
»» Submitted by Jake at 6:30 PM on September 13
I'd buy a t-shirt that says:
"I remember Garrison Keillor when he was funny"
»» Submitted by daughter of icarus at 6:56 PM on September 13
Ol' Garrison has a typical Minnesota Liberal sense of humor.
I'd gladly buy a t-shirt if you startt selling them again.
»» Submitted by »»» mthalo at 7:24 PM on September 13
The Twin Cities can't catch a break lately, what with The Olympic Hopefuls and Spaghetti Western both also getting C&Ds.
»» Submitted by Doug at 7:31 PM on September 13
I wonder how Garrison feels about Al Franken's "The O'Franken Factor" radio show?
I've listened to APHC for decades, but it's become almost unlistenable to me since Bush was elected, as Garrison descends into angry, self-righteous fuddyduddyism. Like Garry Trudeau, he squanders his considerable charm and talent on cliched, bitter invective. All with the requisite nudge and "we-know-what's-what" wink at the NPR audience of self-annointed bien pensants.
This isn't about commercial confusion. It's is about Garrison's inflated self-importance and rage. It's like what Bill O'Reilly did with Al Franken, much to O'Reilly's regret and Franken's delight.
»» Submitted by freetotem at 7:28 PM on September 13
Minneapolis regularly hosts the thrice-yearly meetings of the Internet Engineering Task Force (www.ietf.org). There are a fair number of hard-core internet free speech advocates who attend. I bet you could sell them a fair number of T-shirts protesting these actions. That should draw the attention of the Minneapolis chamber of commerce. After all, that's 2000-3000 people who descend on the city once or twice a year. The city would want to preserve its positive image with these people.
»» Submitted by tf at 7:46 PM on September 13
The T-shirt's not funny. Keillor's not so hot either. But if this T-shirt's actionable, then ship me a busload of lawyers 'cause half the stores in this town sell T-shirts that are worse.
Yeah, his lawyer has to do it to defend the mark. The mark's been duly defended and there's no room for Wal-Mart to slip in and steal Keillior's empire away. Time for the lawyer to crawl back under his rock before he gets the boss in hot water on the whole of this newfangled Intarweb thing.
»» Submitted by A Humorless Cretin at 7:11 PM on September 13
Contact Lawyers for the Arts. They charge about $35 for a consultation. I think they have branches in most states. Just google them to find your local branch.
However, you've already done what Keillor's lawyer wants. You've stopped selling the t-shirt. So as far as they're concerned, they've already won.
So keep selling the t-shirt. I'll buy one just to spite Keillor's lawyer. I think you'll discover they don't want to go to trial either, because they know they'd probably lose.
»» Submitted by Alex B at 8:27 PM on September 13
He's a jerk. I once sent a letter to him when he wrote for Salon, suggesting that perhaps his advice to a letter-writer was lfawed,since he'd ditched his first wife and kid in a pretyt ugly way. He CYBER_STALKED ME for a good two months after wards (albeit poorly-he thought he could read headers,etc.) What a tool
»» Submitted by KateCoe at 8:51 PM on September 13
The ACLU tends to take cases which are strictly religiously- or politically-minded free speech cases, so (nothing binding here, only law student, etc. etc. etc.) see if John Hinderaker can drum up any legal support for you via intellectual property lawyers. And then ask legal counsel if they need a volunteer law student for the case - I'm in. Regardless of whether or not you comply with the cease and desist order, you'll want some legal advice anyway. Good luck, Rex.
»» Submitted by »»» mara at 8:57 PM on September 13
Wow. I can't believe how fired up people are on this! It seems insane that someone who uses the public airwaves and satire to make their living would go after someone else using satire. It'd be like me going after Slanderous Minneapolis for making fun of me on theis site. It's crazy! And that was the spirit of Rex's post... it certainly didn't seem mean. Although I'm glad to see a lot more people visiting MNSpeak!
»» Submitted by »»» jderusha at 9:52 PM on September 13
DISCLAIMER: This is not legal advice. I do not represent you. ATG asked for my take on it. This is what I would do and keep in mind I do not have to pay attorney fees and you may down the road on the matter if these guys are really serious about it:
(1) It seems extremely unlikely a reasonable person could possibly confuse the two. It is very clearly a parody, the name is not designed to mislead, but is exactly the contrary.
(2) It seems unlikely the Plaintiff could prove financial damages. Even if they could, are they collectible?
(3) If you pushed the matter, the plaintiff may seek a temporary injunction (TRO) until a full hearing on the merits (trial) occured. That would be no biggie. It would cost them 15 hours for the TRO in atty fees and cost you a physical presence in the court room representing yourself pro se.
(4) This is a blessing in terms of publicity. I would absolutely make them file a law-suit in the matter. Just make sure you can fill all the shirt orders that are likely to come in if the case hits the paper. Your timing is great.
As to the letter itself: I would respond in writing that you are considering the matter and will notify them of your decision in 30 days after consulting an attorney. Tell them that you are unrepresented and ask them for legal advice. This would force them to write you another letter or two. Get them to write as many letters as possible. This will drive up the costs for the plaintiff, which is always fun. In the interim, that would give you time to sell off your inventory and get ready to print more shirts. Then when the 30 days lapse, write them again and simply say, you offer to settle the matter for $1.00 and that the letter is a settlement offer and not admissable under the rules of evidence. By the time, anything happened it would be another 30 days. If it gets to the point of them filing a law-suit (i.e. TRO) tell ATG to call me and I would look at what they filed. I like this route because it's the American thing to do, makes the f'ers spend money they do not need to and you spend almost nothing, and the best part, you get free publicity.
***Again, this is what I would do only and not legal advice.
»» Submitted by Curious George, Esq. at 9:25 PM on September 13
gotcha back rex! that is some fucking BULLSHIT.
»» Submitted by sb at 10:22 PM on September 13
I wonder if the letter is completely legitimate. It is a letter from someone alleging to be an attorney representing Garrison Keillor. The letter gives no evidence that Mr. Keillor has authorized this Eric Nillson to represent him in this matter. In fact, there is no evidence that this Eric Nillson has even informed Mr. Keillor of this matter (note that two persons were Cc'd on the letter, neither of whom is Mr. Keillor).
I would recommend sending a letter to Mr. Keillor, Cc this Eric Nillson, pointing out that this Nillson character is maligning his good name with this stupidity, and offer to assist Mr. Keillor in any lawsuit he may wish to bring against this Eric Nillson.
If you don't hear directly back from Mr. Keillor, continue with your parody and disregard this Nillson nonsense. Direct no correspondence to Eric Nillson, and let Keillor speak for himself.
»» Submitted by blitz at 10:47 PM on September 13
Why not just make a t-shirt with "Garrison Keillor is a total dickwad idiot" and sell that? I'd buy one.
»» Submitted by John Brabble at 11:25 PM on September 13
Perhaps this has been mentioned already, but is it possible that the colorscheme of your t-shirt is just a little too Wellstonian for Keillor to see the humor?
»» Submitted by fxb at 11:33 PM on September 13
Trademarks need to be defended or they are lost. This is just a fact of life. Even if you win in court by establishing there is no likihood of confusion, Keillor has to take you to court to have that fact established so he doesn't lose his trademark completely.
Relax.
»» Submitted by a reader at 11:45 PM on September 13
I see from your comments you may not understand what he's about to sue you for. Mr. Keillor has no copyright case against you; he's suing for trademark infringement. He also potentially has a dynamite claim under the Anti-Cybersquatting and Consumer Protection Act for your use of the domain name as alleged in the cease and desist letter. His attorney also implies that he could come at you with state based unfair competition torts that are likely arcane and I have no knowledge about how they'd play out.
Mostly, I want to make sure you realize that there is nothing copyright about this going on.
Best of luck,
UC Berkeley Law Student
»» Submitted by Law Student at 11:56 PM on September 13
How about a T-shirt that says, "Garrison Keillor is an embittered and hateful old fool," (or however else you'd like to describe him, such as "&enemy of free speech" or "GK is a s***head'), followed by a copy of the attorney's letter?
»» Submitted by Grundgesetz at 11:20 PM on September 13
I found this story through a link on The Morning News, which is a bunch of people I read regularly but don't know. I'm proud to be able to say that hey, all this controversy started with a guy I met in a bar once. Congratulations on making the big time, and good luck with the fight. When those shirts are available again, I'll buy one.
»» Submitted by Ingrid's Big Sister at 12:08 AM on September 13
'Congratulations Mr. Keillor. Your fame in being a thin-skinned "comedian" who can't take a joke even while viciously criticising others under a thin veneer of humour has reached the People's Republic of China. My students--international law students in the South Central University of Nationalities, Wuhan--are going to have this incident relayed to them as an in-class study for a topical debate.
'I have already collected MNspeak.com's side of this issue, along with several commentators' (both pro and con), into a handout for class perusal. I would like, if at all possible, to hear your side from your mouth (and not the legal jargon of your attorney Eric Nilsson) and present it to the self-same class for their debate.
'I will proceed with the class debate with or without your contribution, I should note, since I have your side indirectly spelled out by your supporters. I feel it would be more fair both to you and to my students, however, if I were to present your side of the issue first-hand.
'I look forward to hearing some good news.'
»» Submitted by Michael at 12:59 AM on September 13
I read a lot of the responses, but not all of them.
You know all those stupid little stickers of Calvin from "Calvin and Hobbes" pissing on logos or phrases that you see on the backs of tons of cars.
That's pretty much the same thing as your t shirt.
I remember reading an interview with Bill Waterson, the creator of Calvin and Hobbes, and the interviewer describes a moment when Waterson, then retired and being a huge recluse, is walking out of a grocery store and sees one of those stupid stickers on a car and just stopping and looking for a second, and its obviously hurting the guy to see his "child" being used in that way.
I'm not going to pretend that I don't like Garrison Keillor, because I do, and I think he says and does a lot of things that that are good and worthy of saying and doing.
I'm also not going to pretend that I think he is as famous, or has had as large of an impact as Calvin and Hobbes either, however, I am going to point out that, though your parody may turn out to be legal, it is not moral.
Just because something is legal or illegal does not make it morally right and wrong. He is obligated to try and protect his trademarks, to prevent a trend from picking up that will take his creations away from him and make them "piss on chevy logos" for all eternity.
So all of this talk about him being a luddite, or a cumudgeon, or whatever, seems like the speak from a bunch of internet busy-bodies who don't have an inkling of an idea of what it is to have a nationally, legally recognized trademark. Much less one that is being parodied for profit (you sold the shirts, you didn't give them away).
Parody is okay, but the way this discussion is slanted you'd think parody was the moral high ground, like it was some kind of shan-gri-la of personal expression.
I do not believe he has much of a real legal case against you, but I do believe you should question wether or not that is important, and wether or not you should be making such "grand" efforts to soil his reputation.
»» Submitted by John Hill at 3:50 AM on September 14
Some of Keillor's humor is amusing. He is staunchly, however, a bona fide, card-carrying, tin foil hat liberal. You gotta remember that! There's one set of rules for them, and another set for everybody else! So, without any mental trepidation, Keillor can still maintain his air of intellectual superiority, while in reality conducting his personal business matters in the most banal manner. But, that's OKAY for liberals! Remember...one set of rules for them...oh, I almost forgot; Dan Rather wasn't biased, either...repeat after me: One set of rules for them...
»» Submitted by Goober at 8:06 AM on September 14
Keillor loves to dish it but he can't take it. What a wimp... I'd like to place an order for a dozen tee shirts please...
»» Submitted by David at 8:23 AM on September 14
Did you ever stop to consider how your actions may have affected Garrison's prostitution activities. I didn't think so!
walk in beauty...
How about a T-shirt with this entire thread?
Might need the front and back.
(Not sure what the morality quotient of that shirt would be.)
»» Submitted by »»» chuck at 8:29 AM on September 14
I've never found Keillor to be entertaining; however as somebody who makes a living in part defending and protecting a nationally recognized trademark, I have to say that for he and his lawyer to persist on this issue, when it is clearly protected speech, is embarrassing (for them). Anyone who works in brand management knows that attacking someone via legal channels when they parody you is a quick trip down bad-PR lane.
»» Submitted by Oversoul at 8:38 AM on September 14
I have never heard of you before. I don't even know your name or the name of your blog.
I listen to Keillor all the time, and have his archive bookmarked.
Do you realize a "Prairie Home Companion" movie by Robert Altman is due to be released soon?
Do what you feel you must, but an angry little blogger isn't going to hurt Keillor in the least, no matter what juvenile postings you feature on this remote little corner of the web.
»» Submitted by Vince at 8:45 AM on September 14
Maybe "A Fairie Ho Companion" would've been more fitting?
»» Submitted by Big Daddy at 9:11 AM on September 14
Wouldn't it be cool if bloggers everywhere started offering these fine, quality products for sale? Hundreds of them? We could be a full-time job for Keillor's counsel.
Look, the only people who would recognize the connection between the shirt and the show would be people that listen to NPR. Who actually listens to NPR? Who actually cares?
»» Submitted by Big Daddy at 9:20 AM on September 14
Garrison Keillor is still alive?
»» Submitted by Greg C at 9:28 AM on September 14
The real question is whether Melissa Gilbert is GK's prairie ho companion - she does have a thing for older men.
»» Submitted by Just a Tom at 9:47 AM on September 14
I for one am going to print up my own run of these shirts and sell them on ebay. That will really piss Keillor off. And if he sends me a cease and desist, I will sell the inventory to my buddy and he can put them all on ebay. Until he gets his cease and desist... etcetera. I would imagine that Keillor lacks the resources of the Recording Industry to track and prosecute all offenders.
»» Submitted by Capitalist Steve at 9:48 AM on September 14
So sad. Garrison Keillor was/is an entertaining guy in many ways. But he's proved himself to be the a$$hole who requires he be the only person in the room who gets to decide what is humorous and what isn't. And as a result he's become one of the people he so despises.
»» Submitted by MikeB at 9:40 AM on September 14
GK blows and sucks. IP is a ridiculous and unenforcable notion anyways.
»» Submitted by o h bush at 9:58 AM on September 14
I used to watch PHC on PBS back in the 80s and bought a tape of a bunch of songs about cats Keillor did that are ALL parodies of well-known tunes, so he understands, or did, the concept of parody. The difference must be that back in those days he was on the way up and understood humor, now he's on the way down and is 'protecting' his intellectual property.
I say do what you can to continue to be an irritant to the has-been.
Retread
»» Submitted by Retread at 9:51 AM on September 14
the guy is so phenomonally boring. christ on a cruthc do people still listen to that self-absorbed windbag.
»» Submitted by marison eeyor at 9:41 AM on September 14
OK, everybody. Flood the Prairie Home Companion site and tell them what dweebs they are.
»» Submitted by Barry Dauphin at 10:05 AM on September 14
What I don't understand is why ALL bloggers don't use a service such as Prepaid Legal which gives you an incredible access to legal aid for like $26/month. If Rex had had a service such as this, he would have had legal representation, and the ability to parry an attack such as this. If you want some info just email me. It's a great plan, and great peace of mind.
GK has made a boondoggle paroding Republican, Jesse Ventura, etc... it's really the pot calling the kettle black! He also has a new movie coming out so he does't want to tarnish the name I guess. Really is sad!!!
Chris
I love it!!!
"Gustafson", "Nilsson". Sounds like Fargo. Great stuff!!!
»» Submitted by Steve Dores at 10:02 AM on September 14
rex stand your ground. GK feels threaten, even though, he shouldn't.
»» Submitted by dig at 10:23 AM on September 14
I used to work tangentally with GK years ago and he is indeed a self-absorbed jerk. Back then at least his folksy little Lake Wobegone stories were packed full of veiled bitchy comments on his colleagues and others. You had to be on the inside to pick up on it, but it was absolutely brutal.
If you should happen to communicate with him again through his lawyer or otherwise, you might also want to mention that he's a terrible singer, since apparently nobody's thought to tell him so far.
»» Submitted by MPR survivor at 10:23 AM on September 14
I had to comment again... since MPR survivor made the comment...
HE IS A TERRIBLE SINGER! One of the funniest moments in all of PHC is when he decided to have an imprompt singing, and everyone was off key... esp him! It was the closing of the show, and I can only imagine people were fleeing for their lives.
He also needs a mic screen on that mic! His breathing through his nostrils sounds something akin to blow torch firing up....
Just proves that in America if you have a dream, some federal money given to you not based upon talent - any democratic-dream is possible.
Chris
http://chrisvaughn.org
gee, a self-absorbed hypocritical liberal entertainer, that's something new.....
»» Submitted by Sam I. Am at 10:36 AM on September 14
Print that letter a little more clearly so we can all call the lawyer and offer to testify. For you.
I also think you've got a gold mine here with other, non-PHC, parody t-shirts. Sign me up on your mailing list. I still drink my morning coffee out of Baghdad Bob cups.
»» Submitted by Mike K at 10:47 AM on September 14
Anyone who wants to protect their copyright in anything must be very vigilant to demand that anyone cease and desist from any action that may infringe on their copyright. The reason is that the copyright holder does not want to run the risk of someone contending that they have waived their copyright. If they let anyone slip by without issuing a cease and desist letter that could be intrepreted as a waiver of their copyright.
»» Submitted by Redman at 10:48 AM on September 14
People who don't want to read the entire thread can post a number from the following code, so that everyone can skip your redundant posts:
1. Keillor is acting like a typical liberal (and I am unaware of the fact that the sellers and designers of the T-shirt are also Minnesota liberals)
2. There's a difference between copyright and trademark
3. I'm a Keillor fan and you're all horrible
4. Ketchup joke
5. Old people joke
6. If you profit from the sale of something (like a T-shirt, or, say, a radio show), you forfeit your right to parody a trademark
Any more?
To recap, freedom of speech is great when Larry Flynt parodies Jerry Falwell, but liberal targets are off limits.
»» Submitted by matt duffy at 11:02 AM on September 14
Oh, and...
7. A copyright/trademark must be vigorously defended or its void
Matt, I think you meant to post:
1
Now we know that all the liberal comedians are above average.
»» Submitted by Joe Baby at 11:13 AM on September 14
You've been Instalanched so that explains why the conservatives. Cause we are open-minded enough to read a moderate libertarian like Insty, and to root for a liberal like MNspeak.
As a conservative, I believe in near absolute First Amendment rights. This applies even when it is my ox being gored. If you make a parody of Limbaugh, (say: "Limblah-blah, Pustulence in Broadcasting Studios") I might not be impressed, but you have a right, at least in my book, to say it.
The fact that you may dilute the brand with a clearly differentiated product is not societies problem, and the fact that Limbaugh spent many years and much sweat creating his product and standing in the marketplace also will not affect my decision.
Parody is a chief weapon of the weak to trim the powerful. (Now I sound like a liberal, or what liberals imagine themselves to be, anyways.) You have to have a better reason than pity for a rich and powerful man for me to trim free speech rights.
I personally welcome seeing liberals fight. Not for the obvious reason, but because you guys have some nuts you need to get rid of. And as long as good table manners prevail, the nuts will continue to sit at the head table.
So "Let's burn down the Prairie! Up against the Cabin! Kill Whitey!"
How about:
8. Keillor is acting like a typical liberal (and I am aware of the fact that the sellers and designers of the T-shirt are also Minnesota liberals and find it very funny)
»» Submitted by Sam I. Am at 11:26 AM on September 14
Actually, Keiller needs this press just as much as you do.
»» Submitted by DoDo at 11:25 AM on September 14
Well, since your parody is not either vulgar or viscious, I think it's fine. This is a beautiful game, in my opinion -- make a move that could be trademark infringment, which could prompt someone's lawyer to send you a C & D. So, depending on how the holder handles your parody you can stop making the current shirt and use the publicity to sell another, wider-audience-appeal, wittier shirt. This shirt would not have any hints of trademark infringement but would sell because people love knocking fuddy-duddies down a notch.
I sure do!
Sounds like a win-win situation for all parties involved - you get a few extra bucks & some traffic, and Keillor (depending on what actually happens) gets a lesson in self-centeredness.
Ah, what a country this USA is. There is always something entertaining going on.
»» Submitted by Mr. G at 10:46 AM on September 14
Who is Garrison Keillor?
»» Submitted by Steve at 11:36 AM on September 14
What if you changed it to "Praire Whore Companion" That way GK has nothing on you (althought it may be less funny).
»» Submitted by Torr828 at 11:33 AM on September 14
The posts about Starbucks failed to mention that Starbucks recently lost a parody case in Texas. A small microbrewer was selling "Starbocks" beer. Starblech sued. The court ruled that the brewer could sell the beer within his home county, which was indeed all he wanted to do. -- http://www.markenbusiness.com/en/news.php?newsid=2237
I suggest avoiding the controversy entirely in the future with t-shirts along the lines of "Garrison Keillor suGKs farts out of subway seats" or "Go fuGK yourself, Garrison Keillor".
»» Submitted by Stan at 11:27 AM on September 14
It seems like Keillor is, in effect, claiming that he is the only one who can profit from prairie hos. If so, Keillor must be the prairie pimp.
»» Submitted by Moklevat at 11:41 AM on September 14
As Shakesphere said, sometimes you've "got to be cruel to be kind". I'm not going to give you sympathy, but something more important to your long-term well being--- a basic explaination of branding and trademarks relative to entrepreneurialship.
GK is just protecting his brand. Parody is free speech until you try to make a buck off of it, then it's called infringement.
If you had just done a free-access parody on your blog or given away the shirts you'd be safe, but selling the T-shirts crossed the line. Sorry bub, but that's the law, which applies to liberals and conservatives alike. Being the little guy isn't going to give you any advantage in court. The fact that you didn't make much or no profit won't be relevant to the court either. The issue is not profit, but infringement.
You might have gotten away with a little branding pilferage had you not printed up a phrase as anthetical to the brand as you did. Subtle infringements are hard to detect in the marketplace, but "Prairie Ho' Companion" sticks out like a flashing red light amidst the other legitimate PHC-brand material.
Also, you made your infringement easy to detect and trace. There's people who are paid to look for infringements; you couldn't have done a better job of attracting their attention than by placing a product that was obviously unlicensed for sale over the internet on your web page.
I suggest that you study the rules surrounding trademarks and copyrights before you go further. GK lawyer's are cutting you some slack by only asking you to "Cease and Desist"; they just as readily could take you to court for infringement and brand defamation, both of which involve paying damages.
Disclaimer: I'm not associated with GK or the legal profession.
»» Submitted by Nova A at 10:49 AM on September 14
What's the record for post with the most comments?
»» Submitted by chuckjr at 11:49 AM on September 14
I can't believe President Bush's incredible insensitivity to this injustice. He sits around his ranch reading BOOKS, if you can believe it, while the First Amendment lies in tatters around his feet. How many more poor and minority bloggers must be sued before he will pull the National Guard out of Iraq to deal with this issue? How much more carbon dioxide must be spewed into the atmosphere by the talkmeisters of Minnesota before he realizes that global warming MUST BE STOPPED! Where is FEMA when the levees of our liberty break and the flood waters trap freedom-loving bloggers in Cyberdomes where injunction-wielding lawyers terrorize the helpless victims who are trapped there?
And what about Karl Rove? Don't tell me he's not behind this! The man must be stopped. Today it's a harmless T-shirt... tomorrow he'll be leaking your underwear size to some neo-con "journalist" at the New York Times. This is SO OBVIOUSLY an insidious plot to undermine the influence progressive spokesbeings like Mr. Keillor. It's the only credible explanation for an injustice of this order.
And don't overlook the John Roberts connection, here! With Chief Justice "John" Roberts at the helm, you can kiss your precious civil liberties goodbye. Oh, sure, he's just LOOKING for a chance to score a few "liberal" points by ruling in favor of an icon like "The Prairie Home [censored]." He'll have Hillary eating out of his hand like a trained sheltie once he authors the unanimous majority opinion in THIS little case. It's perfect: he sides with capitalist thugs while getting credit for his "open mindedness," and she smirks while she sells out the progressive/left coalition on her mad march to power.
Required reading on Keillor
»» Submitted by Scof at 11:51 AM on September 14
I think it's time for a "A Danish Ho's Comanion" T-shirt.
»» Submitted by Richard R at 11:00 AM on September 14
I think this quote from the Required Reading sums up GK's schtick:
"So I'll be feeding you mostly shit,"
»» Submitted by puffdaddy at 12:02 PM on September 14
It's a parody!
NPR fans, please get a grip. Your opinion of the degree of humor in this is irrelevent. Parody has been protected for decades.
Think of all the parodies Keillor does on his shows. Or pick up any copy of Mad magazine. Or watch Saturday Night Vile (uh, I mean Evil, no I mean Live). Think how outraged most of these good liberal types would be if the target of any parody were to sue Keillor or Mad or SNL.... and yet here their outrage seems to be against someone who came up with a parody t-shirt.
Hey, it's just speaking truth to power!
LOL
»» Submitted by Jim at 11:27 AM on September 14
Consider the little mouse, how sagacious an animal it is which never entrusts his life to one hole only.
~Plautus
Um, can we close off this hole now? Maybe get a promise from Rex to post any upcoming television or radio inteviews so we can tune in? I don't seem to have the discipline to stop reading these, and it's eating up all my time...
»» Submitted by crazymouse at 11:51 AM on September 14
Typical Liberal asshole--OK to make fun of people he approves of, but not OK to be parodied--What a dipshit.
»» Submitted by RogerA at 12:07 PM on September 14
Ditto
»» Submitted by RushIsCool at 12:12 PM on September 14
Pete, you forgot 1a: everything comes down to liberal vs. conservative, especially in this case even though there is no basis for it. And for constructive discourse all you have to do is say liberals suck and vise versa.
»» Submitted by spacemanpete at 12:03 PM on September 14
I think it's funny. I'll buy one if I still can. If Mr. Unfunny's lawyers object to the cash, you can donate my money to your favorite cause. Surely there's a national legal defense fund to help average people when they're threatened with senseless lawsuits. Give the money to them.
»» Submitted by Lou Minatti at 12:12 PM on September 14
John the Baptist : Jesus Christ :: Will Rogers : Garrison Keillor
Garrison Keillor is The Homespun Conscience of the World, so stop making fun of Doonesbury!
»» Submitted by gs at 12:09 PM on September 14
Ketchup...f-f-funny!
I've enjoyed the Prairie Home Companion, but Mr. Keillor has gotten a bit overtly political, that or I've just recognized it more. In any event, his show is tainted, like a soda with a bug in it. I'm afraid I have to toss the whole thing now.
»» Submitted by Bryan at 12:14 PM on September 14
Instead of using GK's name, which is, no doubt trademarked,
you could print up a tee-shirt saying:
"Someone at NPR is a totally clueless braindead a**h***"
Your problem would then be that the entire NPR staff
and talent bench would think you are referring to them.
You, of course, would win every case because in a
libel case, the absolute truth is an absolute defense.
btw I think PHC is mildly amusing. I don't think your
teeshirt reaches even that low standard.
Just make sure you never, ever parody ...
"The Spanish Inquistion (tm)"
"I'm not a ...
but 1,000 drowned
... is a good start".
»» Submitted by Ted at 11:50 AM on September 14
What a whiney, self-important punk you are. I give hard-earned money to the ACLU...please don't waste their time or resources on this non-issue. The have much more important things to do.
»» Submitted by watty at 12:22 PM on September 14
You ought to thank Keillor for the promo! I got here via an Instapundit link...you have arrived!
»» Submitted by j3sdad at 12:27 PM on September 14
I just skimmed through some of the responses, so please forgive me if this has been said...
Does anyone own the phrase "A Prairie Ho Companion".
You could start you're own brand!
»» Submitted by Nairb at 12:37 PM on September 14
These guys are only getting paid for the legal stationery. The legal threat is nonexistant, and they know it. Are you guys who recommend capitulation kidding? Nothing will happen. Go on doing exactly what you were doing. I ignore letters from lawyers all the time. It's a scare tactic. You can parody anything you want any time you want for as much profit as you want, and there is nothing anybody in the U.S. can do about it. (Or should, but that's not a legal matter) And if they actually try to, just find a pro bono lawyer and you've won the moment you step into court. And I would immediately print 100 more of those shirts! Prairie Ho' Companion forever!
»» Submitted by darkcoffee at 12:55 PM on September 14
I'll write a song about it if you'd like.
E-mail me: apeville@comcast.net
I love taking on things like this.
»» Submitted by zilla at 12:55 PM on September 14
I have been a fan of "A Prairie Home Companion" for years, and have seen the show live twice. My favorite person in the troupe is Pat Donohue, guitarist extroidinaire.
But I have been a fan of the Constitution Of The United States Of America for a much longer time. You are clearly not attempting copyright infringement, but merely creating a punny little word-play. You have my support.
Keillor could take a lesson from the British royal family in this instance. They normally ignore such things as being beneath their notice. Makes them look smarter than they actually are.
A question: why did you not point out the funny little typographical error in the legal document's first paragraph?
»» Submitted by Wesley Loftis at 12:55 PM on September 14
Manual Trackback"
Hmmm, I wonder what Garrison Keillor's position was on the parody novel "The Wind Done Gone". Margaret Mitchell's estate sued the author of the parody and lost. It's not quite the same thing (there were copyright issues at stake, as well as the trademark issues), but the net effect is almost the same. And as was pointed out above, the "O'Franken Factor" is an even better fit, since it is a trademark infraction almost identical to this, except the defendent in this case is a small operator without the financial backing to defend himself.
»» Submitted by timekeeper at 12:34 PM on September 14
One word, Garrison: Metamucil
»» Submitted by cris at 1:09 PM on September 14
Interesting. Is Mr. Keillor himself posting commments here using several different fake names?
»» Submitted by Sleuth at 1:26 PM on September 14
Keillor's just jealous because the t-shirt is funny and he's not.
»» Submitted by Satyricon at 1:48 PM on September 14
Last Word....This goes to show that most people that respond to blogs have little interesting to say, never read the thread to see if what they are saying is redundant and like to rant and rave with little to no actual information on what is going on. With the advent of Satellite TV you all should have your own talk shows it would be at least as good as Bill O-Reilly (Altho his dirty talk is probably better). Altho you would be the only one watching them.
»» Submitted by doug at 1:35 PM on September 14
A couple of things, just for the hell of it: NPR doesn't have anything to do with the show or with Keillor. I believe that Keillor himself (not MN Public Radio) actually owns the show and the trademark. His production company produces the show, and it's distributed by American Public Media. Most of the stations that carry the show are also NPR affiliates, of course.
»» Submitted by Marlys at 1:52 PM on September 14
Just take up a collection to have 1000 new copies of the shirt printed up. Non-profit, you know? Then just give them away all over hell. Drum up publicity for this. Make it backfire in Kiellor's face.
Oh, and print up a few that say, "Lake Ho-be-gone."
»» Submitted by jojo at 1:48 PM on September 14
The starbucks coffee & coffehouses / starbOcks beer case is different than this. That was a pure likelihood of confusion case; this is parody. The law allows a small, regional first user of a mark to continue using his mark in his regional market if a bigger, badder nationwide mark later takes over. For example, there is a small restaraunt in rural Illinois called Burger King that is in no way connected with the dude in the creepy, stylized king costume you see in T.V. ads.
Here, the new "parody" mark is intended to make fun of the original mark. Thus, it's more like the first starbucks case, where the parody had the same intent. Thus, the tarnishment argument is still open for Keillor. (But that might just discorge profits, not get an injunction against use)...
»» Submitted by Tanker J.D. at 2:24 PM on September 14
Chuck,
Wow, so much hate! Am I the only one here who loves both MNSpeak and A Prairie Home Companion?
»» Submitted by chuck t at 10:31 AM on September 13
Yes. There are also those of us who are bored shiteless by both Keillor and this site.
»» Submitted by thibaud at 2:24 PM on September 14
What gives? I thought that liberals like Keillor loved the coerced redistribution of wealth. He should be happy to spread the bucks around.
Sounds like Keillor's just another Running Dog Kaptalist.
»» Submitted by Kevin F at 3:18 PM on September 14
please forward this on to eric neal
* Fair Use
There are two situations where the doctrine of fair use prevents infringement:
1. The term is a way to describe another good or service, using its descriptive term and not its secondary meaning. The idea behind this fair use is that a trademark holder does not have the exclusive right to use a word that is merely descriptive, since this decreases the words available to describe. If the term is not used to label any particular goods or services at all, but is perhaps used in a literary fashion as part of a narrative, then this is a non-commercial use even if the narrative is commercially sold.
2. Nominative fair use
This is when a potential infringer (or defendant) uses the registered trademark to identify the registrants product or service in conjunction with his or her own. To invoke this defense, the defendant must prove the following elements:
o his/her product or service cannot be readily identified without pointing to the registrants mark
o he/she only uses as much of the mark as is necessary to identify the goods or services
o he/she does nothing with the mark to suggest that the registrant has given his approval to the defendant
* Parody Use
Parodies of trademarked products have traditionally been permitted in print and other media publications. A parody must convey two simultaneous -- and contradictory -- messages: that it is the original, but also that it is not the original and is instead a parody.
* Non-commercial Use
If no income is solicited or earned by using someone else's mark, this use is not normally infringement. Trademark rights protect consumers from purchasing inferior goods because of false labeling. If no goods or services are being offered, or the goods would not be confused with those of the mark owner, or if the term is being used in a literary sense, but not to label or otherwise identify the origin of other goods or services, then the term is not being used commercially.
* Product Comparison and News Reporting
Even in a commercial use, you can refer to someone elses goods by their trademarked name when comparing them to other products. News reporting is also exempt.
* Geographic Limitations
A trademark is protected only within the geographic area where the mark is used and its reputation is |
Man, this guy is getting old.
